So many mothers feel they have to do everything “perfect” as a mom. Where does this come from? Society? Our childhood? Our work-culture? In this episode, I welcome Michelle Kenney who is a former teacher and high school counselor, mother, and a recovering perfectionist and control freak to talk all about how motherhood perfectionism is ruining motherhood and how to combat it.

We discuss:

• Why we get caught up in trying to be a “perfect” parent
• How to approach motherhood instead
• How to look at motherhood with a growth-mindset

 

Find out more about The Yelling Cure, Michelle’s Podcast or follow her on Facebook and Instagram @peaceandparenting.

00;00;01;02 – 00;00;23;14

Michelle Kenney

It’s exactly the opposite of perfectionism, right? You don’t have to do it perfectly to be a great mom. You don’t have to say all the perfect words and have the most amazing meals and have an Instagram worthy, you know, experience with your children to enjoy them. And for it to be a great experience for them and an incredible childhood.

 

00;00;23;22 – 00;00;39;27

Michelle Kenney

It’s messy. They’re going to tell you no. You’re going to yell when you don’t mean to. You know, they’re going to sneak out and take a car or and those things are okay. And if we can normalize this idea that none of it has to be perfect and we don’t put so much pressure on us.

 

00;00;39;29 – 00;00;58;17

Dr. Mona

Hey, everyone, welcome back to the PedsDocTalk podcast. This podcast continues to grow because of you and your reviews. So thank you for tuning in and listening to the conversations I have with my guests. The conversations I give to you on my own. This is such a joy to do for you, and I am so excited to welcome my next guest, which is Michelle Kenny.

 

00;00;58;17 – 00;01;17;14

Dr. Mona

She is a former teacher and high school counselor, mom of two teenagers, and a recovering perfectionist, control freak, and yeller. Hey, that sounds like me. Helping parents find more calm at home. And we are talking about motherhood perfectionism. Thank you so much for joining me today, Michelle.

 

00;01;17;17 – 00;01;25;04

Michelle Kenney

Thank you for having me. I’m excited for this conversation. It’s kind of near and dear to me, so thank you for letting me bend your ear.

 

00;01;25;07 – 00;01;42;15

Dr. Mona

Well, I’m so excited because it is near and dear to me, not only as a newer mom. I mean, I have a two and a half year old, but also someone who shares educational and parenting content for a lot of moms on my social. So this is going to be a really great conversation. But tell me more about yourself and why you do what you do.

 

00;01;42;17 – 00;02;06;02

Michelle Kenney

I am a mom of two teenagers that are 13 and 16 and that, like I said, I’m a former high school teacher and counselor and I thought I was going to be this incredible mom because I had this great background in education, and I think motherhood almost took me down. It just was way harder than I had ever imagined, and I couldn’t find my footing.

 

00;02;06;02 – 00;02;23;24

Michelle Kenney

And I think I really lost my way. And I finally, when I found some things that worked and felt good and helped me at home, feel more calm, I wanted to share it because I didn’t realize everyone was struggling out there, and not all of us have. The resources weren’t readily available to everybody.

 

00;02;23;26 – 00;02;32;04

Dr. Mona

And when did you notice that? Did you notice that right immediately when you became a mom? Did it sort of snowball? Did it kind of happen later in your parenting journey?

 

00;02;32;06 – 00;02;53;20

Michelle Kenney

So right at the beginning, I thought, I’m going to be an attachment mom. Like, I want to breastfeed and I want to co-sleep and I want to do all these things, and I did them to such a level that I think I almost killed myself because I thought I had to be the perfect parent. And so I think attachment parenting almost killed me because I took it to the umpteenth.

 

00;02;53;22 – 00;03;08;19

Michelle Kenney

The big breaking point was my daughter, who at two years old, she told me no right to my face that she wasn’t going to put her shoes on, and she threw the shoes down the hall. And at that moment, all I could think of as I have to scream at this child to get her to stop throwing her shoes.

 

00;03;08;22 – 00;03;21;07

Michelle Kenney

And I went on this deep path of a lot of yelling, a lot of shame, a lot of punishment, a lot of ridicule because I couldn’t get my kids to behave the way I wanted them to. And that was like the deep, dark hole I went down.

 

00;03;21;09 – 00;03;41;00

Dr. Mona

Well, this is exactly what we’re talking about, this perfectionism, right? We get into this mode of feeling or having expectations of motherhood or how we’re going to mother look a certain way, and then when it doesn’t always go according to plan, it’s the situation that like you just mentioned. So you also talk about good enough parenting. You know, I know we’re talking about motherhood, perfectionism.

 

00;03;41;00 – 00;03;44;24

Dr. Mona

But describe to our listeners what you mean by good enough parenting.

 

00;03;44;26 – 00;04;08;05

Michelle Kenney

I mean, I think it’s exactly the opposite of perfectionism, right? You don’t have to do it perfectly to be a great mom. You don’t have to say all the perfect words and have the most amazing meals and have an Instagram worthy, you know, experience with your children to enjoy them and for it to be an a great experience for them and an incredible childhood.

 

00;04;08;11 – 00;04;31;00

Michelle Kenney

It’s messy. They’re going to tell, you know, you’re going to yell when you don’t mean to. You know, they’re going to sneak out and take the car or and those things are okay. And if we can normalize this idea that none of it has to be perfect and we don’t put so much pressure on us. And I feel like a lot of that pressure really eats at our psyche and really, makes it harder to parent.

 

00;04;31;03 – 00;04;33;09

Dr. Mona

And you have two teenagers, right?

 

00;04;33;11 – 00;04;33;27

Michelle Kenney

Yeah.

 

00;04;34;00 – 00;04;34;23

Dr. Mona

How old are they?

 

00;04;34;28 – 00;04;37;05

Michelle Kenney

13 and 16.

 

00;04;37;07 – 00;04;59;13

Dr. Mona

Well, you’re in it, right? I love when I have guests that are further along in the parenting journey than I am. Meaning, you know, we’re all going through the same feelings. I agree, but you have 13, 16 more years of experience in terms of this experience is what I’m talking about. This realization, this understand not about how to be a parent, but how to be a woman who is going into this new role.

 

00;04;59;13 – 00;05;16;10

Dr. Mona

And there’s just so much expectations that I think that are set on us and unmet expectations that causes disappointment. Why do you think we’ve gotten to this mode, this mode that we have to be this perfect parent? Do you think it comes from childhood social media combination of both, like where do you think we’re getting this from?

 

00;05;16;12 – 00;05;34;06

Michelle Kenney

Well, I do think there’s this societal norm that if your child is bad or acting bad, or doing something wrong, or throwing sand at the kid in the sandbox in the playground, that somehow it’s your fault and you obviously don’t have control of your kids, and you obviously don’t know how to parent. And none of which is true.

 

00;05;34;06 – 00;05;49;21

Michelle Kenney

But I think deep in our minds, we believe that, right? If we have a bad kid, then we’re going to be chastised and thought of as bad, and they’re going to be thought of as quote unquote bad. And so we work so hard to make it look right so that we are not judged. I think that’s part of it.

 

00;05;49;23 – 00;06;12;26

Michelle Kenney

I know for me, I lived in a household of, you know, yelling and shame and ridicule and all of these things. And so when I got to parenting, I thought, I have to do it perfectly because I have to avoid shame, because shame reminded me of my childhood and shame brought me down. And so if I could just do it perfectly, then I could avoid all the shame and I could never do it perfectly.

 

00;06;12;26 – 00;06;26;23

Michelle Kenney

So I lived in this terrible shame and I wouldn’t let go of my mistakes. I wouldn’t let go of like, yeah, you screwed up. You yelled, it’s okay. Apologize. Move on. They’ll live. It’s all right. And so we get stuck there sometimes. Or at least I did.

 

00;06;26;25 – 00;06;48;12

Dr. Mona

Yeah. And you mentioned that realization when your daughter was two years old and not wanting to wear the shoes and you’re like, wait, I’m going to have to pivot here and figure out what to do. You know, I completely resonate with this and agree with you. And I think women, you know, for me, I feel like a lot of women, I’m not saying all girls, but a lot of us were raised with a perfectionism mindset from just being women.

 

00;06;48;16 – 00;07;04;23

Dr. Mona

Right. Like this sort of how am I supposed to behave? How am I supposed to act? And you grow up, you know, like having to fit this sort of mold as a female, you know, be polite, be a people pleaser. Like all of the things, you cannot be a people pleaser to your child because they’re not going to love everything that you do.

 

00;07;04;29 – 00;07;25;06

Dr. Mona

And then all of a sudden there, your whole mentality of people pleasing and perfectionism is being thrown in your face because it’s just another human being, being a human being and right. You’re responsible for taking care of them and teaching them that all feelings are feelings, but not all actions are warranted, you know? And that’s hard to, I think, come to a realization for a lot of females that I need to undo this.

 

00;07;25;09 – 00;07;40;26

Michelle Kenney

Yeah, I think there’s a lot of pressure on women in this society, in this world, to be everything. You have to have the perfect meals and the perfect kid and the perfect house, and you have to work and, you know, the nursery better look a certain way. And then, you know, we do go on social media and we look at all these pictures.

 

00;07;40;26 – 00;07;54;27

Michelle Kenney

I mean, even people have said on my social media, like, you have all these amazing suggestions like, I can never do it. And I think we feel as if we have to do everything that’s out there and put in our face. Well, we don’t we just we do what we can.

 

00;07;54;29 – 00;08;16;07

Dr. Mona

Yeah. And I think, you know, you have older children, but right now what’s happening in social media and I’m sure you’re very much aware because you just mentioned that. But is the over information, I think it’s so beautiful that you have your practice that you have. I, you know, do what I do and it’s great to be able to have other outlets to share our information.

 

00;08;16;07 – 00;08;34;11

Dr. Mona

But when you’re consuming this, as someone who is trying to be perfect, right, you can overdo it and say, wow, well, I’m seeing this person say this and using your example of attachment parenting, right? You went in it thinking that that’s what you were going to do and it didn’t work for you. Maybe that works for another family, right?

 

00;08;34;11 – 00;08;48;19

Dr. Mona

Maybe gentle parenting works for you and doesn’t work for me, blah blah blah. But it’s all about finding your identity and then working with your child to find what works with each other. And that can be really hard when you’ve lost your identity in this whole motherhood craziness, if you will.

 

00;08;48;23 – 00;09;14;25

Michelle Kenney

Well, I think that’s exactly it. We get into this fervor where we’re so scared, like, what am I doing? This is so hard. And then we go on social media and we start consuming all this information. And it’s not social media, really. It’s the way in which you interpret it. Right? You can’t go on social media and think that every post we’re going to have to, you know, adhere to perfectly, people are putting out information because it’s their best information and they’re flooding you with it.

 

00;09;14;27 – 00;09;17;01

Michelle Kenney

You don’t have to take it all in.

 

00;09;17;04 – 00;09;47;25

Dr. Mona

Oh yeah, it is on the consumer also to understand that it is what it is, and you have to be very careful on when it’s affecting you. I mean, I actually released an episode a few weeks ago about social media and how it affects our mental health, which is I know we’re talking about that, but it is very important that you are being very mindful of all of that when you’re looking at what me and Michelle are talking about, because like you said, the Insta worthy photos, the meals, all of that is just going to keep getting in your head, and then you’re going to be staring and sitting there like, wait, what just happened?

 

00;09;47;25 – 00;10;05;23

Dr. Mona

I can’t make these arts and crafts. I don’t want to be like an arts and crafts mom, but but you feel like you need to because you’re seeing it on social, right? You see? Or you see your friend on the street, like doing X, Y and Z, like putting their kids in soccer and like all the activities. And you’re like, I don’t want to do that, but should I be doing that?

 

00;10;05;23 – 00;10;08;03

Dr. Mona

Because society’s telling me that’s so stressful.

 

00;10;08;05 – 00;10;27;13

Michelle Kenney

That’s that’s spot on. That is it. It’s like we believe that all of this stuff in our face is has to be our reality. And it really just it doesn’t. We have to pick what works and what feels good. And like I work with a lot of clients every day, and so many of them come to me and they are talking so unkindly to themselves, I’m a horrible mother.

 

00;10;27;13 – 00;10;45;09

Michelle Kenney

I yelled at my kid, I did this, I’m so bad. And I’m thinking like, why? Why are we talking to ourselves like this? And why are we shaming ourselves? And why are we having these huge expectations of motherhood around? Is it social media? Is it our own selves? What is it? But all I’m saying is it doesn’t need to be that way.

 

00;10;45;12 – 00;11;06;00

Dr. Mona

And I, you know, introduced you and I said that you were a recovering perfectionist, control freak and yeller. And I said it also at the beginning that I also am in that same boat. And I think it comes from all the things that we just talked about, maybe from childhood, maybe being high achieving women, you know, the combination of the two, and also perfectionism in childhood as well.

 

00;11;06;00 – 00;11;24;07

Dr. Mona

I mean, perfect attendance awards. And how’s the school system? You know, your towards children. I mean, it’s all it’s almost like a perfect storm of feeding into this feeling that you’re describing. And how and when I would say, did you realize that you needed to change this? And of course, you created this practice where you have clients now that you’re helping.

 

00;11;24;07 – 00;11;35;12

Dr. Mona

But when was it in your mother, her journey, or was it before becoming a mom that you realized, I need to fix this mindset, this perfectionism, this control freak, and, you know, being a yeller?

 

00;11;35;14 – 00;11;55;17

Michelle Kenney

You know what? I think I started this journey when as me, was my oldest with six and my youngest was three. And I think that’s when I really realized that I was putting a lot of pressure on her, my oldest especially, to be perfect. And it was all because of my own insecurities and my own shame and my own stuff.

 

00;11;55;17 – 00;12;08;02

Michelle Kenney

So I think that year in particular, I really realized it. And then I dove really more deeply into parenting with less yelling and less control and more love.

 

00;12;08;04 – 00;12;27;04

Dr. Mona

Oh, I love it. And you’ve already talked about, you know, what your you did or what you’ve tried to do for your own parenting journey. But what would you say to other mothers or even other fathers that are listening on how to reframe when they find themselves feeling this? I’m not good enough and I need to be perfect.

 

00;12;27;04 – 00;12;30;07

Dr. Mona

Like, what are some tips that you would give these families?

 

00;12;30;09 – 00;12;50;20

Michelle Kenney

I would say life is full of mistakes. Life is full of ruptures and repairs, and the best thing you can do for your kids is to apologize and to say I messed up, and to let them know that perfection is not the way to go, and the best way to tell them that perfection isn’t the way to go is to openly accept their mistakes.

 

00;12;50;20 – 00;13;05;09

Michelle Kenney

And then they openly accept yours. And we just rupture and repair, and we get through the murkiness the best way we can. We speak to as kindly as we can to ourselves and tell ourselves, it’s okay, you’re not perfect, and thank goodness you’re not.

 

00;13;05;11 – 00;13;27;24

Dr. Mona

Yeah. And oh, I just feel this so strongly because I feel like when people hear this, they can just get that permission to let it go. Because sometimes, like you feel like you have to hold it all together for your kids or hold it all together for your partner. If you have a partner or, you know, hold all together at your work like it’s okay to be vulnerable and just to say, well, like you said earlier, also that what is it that I want in this journey?

 

00;13;27;24 – 00;13;49;07

Dr. Mona

Like what is it that I’m what are my goals? Not what are social media’s goals or my partner’s goals? I mean, obviously you need to be hopefully on the similar page with your partner if you have one. But what do I want out of this role? I think oftentimes we forget that this is like, I’m not saying that this is a job, because then it takes the it sounds like it’s mundane, but like like a job, like being what you do and also being a pediatrician.

 

00;13;49;07 – 00;14;07;11

Dr. Mona

Right. Like every day I’m it’s practice, right? I’m learning as I go. Like I’m learning about new things. I’m learning how to communicate. I’m getting better in my skill as a pediatrician, similar to being a mother. Right? Like every day you’re learning something new. You maybe yelled yesterday, but then today you’re like, hey, look at that. I didn’t yell today.

 

00;14;07;11 – 00;14;23;15

Dr. Mona

Or maybe I did, and that’s okay. I’m not going to beat myself up over it, but it’s about that sort of process that I think people feel like it’s so fixed and then they get lost in this like fixed mindset that, okay, this is what I am, I can’t change. No, you’re supposed to evolve in this way. And I think we often forget that.

 

00;14;23;17 – 00;14;26;22

Michelle Kenney

Yeah, very much so. I think that’s so true. Yeah.

 

00;14;26;27 – 00;14;31;26

Dr. Mona

Any other tips like in terms of this reframing, when they find themselves feeling like they’re not good enough.

 

00;14;31;29 – 00;14;40;28

Michelle Kenney

I’d say like back to social media for just one second. I see a lot of, you know, scripts like, you shouldn’t say this, but yeah, if that happens, you should say, oh my.

 

00;14;40;28 – 00;14;42;28

Dr. Mona

Gosh, I’m so glad you’re bringing this up. Go ahead.

 

00;14;43;01 – 00;15;02;22

Michelle Kenney

And I put those out to write. Those are great things. They’re good reminders. They are not the end all be all. They are just a suggestion. They are just a pathway. And I think like, you know, in in gentle parenting until people say like, oh, I’m, you know, I know you’re feeling upset and I’m right here and that’s great.

 

00;15;02;22 – 00;15;35;23

Michelle Kenney

Say that, that’s cool. But the way in which you can really make change in your parenting or you can really, like, feel like live in your parenting like it’s yours, you own it is to find your own, you know, phrase and find your own way and take that idea and make it your own. If you like that idea, you don’t have to say every single word out there in the right order in order to be a good parent, and that if you have the mindset like, I want to come with kindness to my child, what does that mean for me internally?

 

00;15;35;25 – 00;15;38;09

Michelle Kenney

And what words make sense for me and my kid?

 

00;15;38;11 – 00;15;59;03

Dr. Mona

Again, I’m just so glad you brought up the script thing, because I didn’t realize that that was happening until I joined social media that people parenting accounts talk about scripts, and I think they’re wonderful to some degree. I agree with you. You said you do it. I have not done it yet, because what I find that happens and I hear it in my office, is that then you become a perfectionist trying to follow a script you are trying to memorize versus incorporate.

 

00;15;59;04 – 00;16;17;12

Dr. Mona

Right? And I think you just mentioned that, like, it’s not that you should be a robot and say, here’s my script. It’s like you want to get the concept of what are you trying to get? And I find that that can lead to more perfectionism. And then it backfires because you’re like, okay, here’s this moment, here’s this moment, and I want to say the right thing, but sometimes you’re not going to say the right thing.

 

00;16;17;12 – 00;16;22;20

Dr. Mona

Sometimes I want you to say the wrong thing so that you learn to say the right thing the next time, you know. Yes.

 

00;16;22;20 – 00;16;38;02

Michelle Kenney

You know, what’s so interesting, though, is that when I put out an idea, sometimes I’ll put out, like, come to your child with love. When they mess up, they’ll be like, what do you mean? Yeah, tell me the words I need to say. I’ll get like 20 comments like that. And then I’m like, okay, I need to tell them I get sucked in, right?

 

00;16;38;02 – 00;16;55;27

Michelle Kenney

Yeah. I got, you know, it’s an ideas. But then I get sucked and I’m like, oh, okay, well, here’s what I say to my kid all the time. This is I say, I hear you, I’m right here. I understand how you’re feeling. And then people like, oh my gosh, thank you for the words. And so it’s I don’t know, we have to find I think that parenting is a mindset.

 

00;16;55;29 – 00;17;14;24

Michelle Kenney

You have an ideology, right? I want to be kind. I want to be empathic. I want to have boundaries with and limits. But I want to do it without yelling and screaming. And if you have that framework and that mindset, it will all come to you. You don’t need us to give you the words.

 

00;17;14;27 – 00;17;33;10

Dr. Mona

Oh, I feel this so much. And like I said, if people listening like the words, I nothing against the words. If you’re finding yourself hearing the scripts and then when in the moment you’re feeling flustered because either you can’t remember and you’re trying so hard to remember and you feel like you’re not a good parent because you didn’t get it right, that is what we don’t want.

 

00;17;33;13 – 00;17;49;15

Dr. Mona

We don’t want the script to make you feel worse. It should make you feel more empowered. And I agree with that. And then you also talked about, you know, gentle parenting. And again, there’s a lot of different parenting philosophies out there. And I think they’re all wonderful. Like even like you said, attachment parenting, right? You went deep into attachment parenting.

 

00;17;49;15 – 00;18;07;19

Dr. Mona

But there’s principles of attachment parenting. There’s principles that you can take from each type of parenting style to create your own style, which is what you mentioned. And sometimes I found that a lot of gentle parents, let’s use that terminology in quotes. They feel like they need to fill the space with verbalization. I hear you, sweetie. I see you.

 

00;18;07;25 – 00;18;25;15

Dr. Mona

Sometimes. Silence is best, like letting your kid just be upset and just sitting with them and just letting them have the moment. And I think with the gentle parenting, sometimes we feel like we need to know that they know that we’re there. And by knowing that it’s the words. But sometimes it’s just your body. And I guess I forget that.

 

00;18;25;17 – 00;18;31;24

Michelle Kenney

That is so important. So I tell my clients 80% of empathy is listening.

 

00;18;31;28 – 00;18;32;25

Dr. Mona

 

00;18;32;27 – 00;18;44;24

Michelle Kenney

That’s it. You just have to sit there and recognize that you see them with eye contact. I know you’re struggling. I don’t have to say anything. I’m staying here with you and I know you’re struggling. That’s it I’m here.

 

00;18;44;26 – 00;19;04;13

Dr. Mona

It’s like a therapist right. Like I mean when you go to if you just meet anybody, like any human being that you feel heard by, right? Like you see a therapist or go to a friend that you can think of right now that is like your go to that person that makes you feel good. Probably allowed a pause before they started talking to let that digest.

 

00;19;04;13 – 00;19;23;25

Dr. Mona

And almost it almost is like, again, that nonverbal cue of, hey, I’m here, I’m listening to you, and I don’t need to offer you a solution, right? Like, I think so many times as when we get into this perfectionism mindset is, okay, my kid cannot be upset. No, your kid is going to be upset. I actually want them to be upset because through being upset, will they learn something?

 

00;19;24;02 – 00;19;41;15

Michelle Kenney

Well they’ll learn. Yeah, they’ll learn resilience. And that’s the beauty of just being there. So if your kid is upset and you sit with them through the upset without even saying anything. Yeah. And then they feel better, they’re going to oh no. Oh my gosh, I can be upset and I can feel better. And nobody’s trying to fix my feelings.

 

00;19;41;15 – 00;19;49;08

Michelle Kenney

And now I’ve built resilience. And I know in the future when I’m by myself, I can get through the hard moments because I remember what that felt like.

 

00;19;49;10 – 00;20;04;03

Dr. Mona

Oh, and it feels good. Like, I mean, I never got that growing up. I don’t know about me, so maybe that’s why we’re the way that maybe that’s why we’re recovering perfectionists. And yes, but no, I didn’t get that growing up. And it’s what we’re trying to do for our son. And I think we’re doing a pretty good job because we recognize that we didn’t get that as children.

 

00;20;04;03 – 00;20;21;03

Dr. Mona

And I think a lot of this parenting job is realizing the things that were not done well and the things that were done well when you were a child and not blaming your parents for everything. I know our parents did not do a lot of great things. I get it that people want to blame and push the blame, but when you’re an adult now, you can’t go back.

 

00;20;21;03 – 00;20;36;23

Dr. Mona

In the past. You can say, you can say, look, this happened to me like my dad was a yeller. And I think you said that your dad was a yeller as well, right? I didn’t like it. I don’t think my dad did something right. But my dad had his reasons for yelling. So now I’m the only one responsible for fixing how I yell.

 

00;20;36;23 – 00;20;57;09

Dr. Mona

My dad’s not going to help me, right? I’m an adult. So I think sometimes also in this perfectionism mindset, we kind of get in the sort of, okay, well, I’m going to do this and this is what I am. And also in that perfectionism mindset, we do not give room that we need to change because we think we’re perfect or we have this sort of mentality that I got a hold on, but I was holding on to that yelling.

 

00;20;57;09 – 00;21;11;05

Dr. Mona

I was holding on to being a control freak. But that wasn’t making anything better in my marriage, in my as like, you know. So I did that work before having Ryan. I was like, I need to change this. And if it makes you feel better about your like, it’s not even for anyone else, it’s for you.

 

00;21;11;07 – 00;21;29;03

Michelle Kenney

If we’re talking about parenting, you parent better when you feel better, it’s like, okay, yes, that makes complete sense. It’s just. And back to the parents. Like, I love my parents so much. They did a lot of wrong things, but they didn’t know any better. They didn’t know and they didn’t mean to, and they didn’t want to hurt us.

 

00;21;29;05 – 00;21;32;20

Michelle Kenney

They just did. And it’s okay. It’s okay.

 

00;21;32;22 – 00;21;54;16

Dr. Mona

And I know that’s I love talking to you. I know we’re talking about perfectionism, but we’re also talking about generational trauma. But it’s all connected, like it’s all connected. And I love talking about our childhood because I think it’s just you can go back to all the things that we’re saying, right? This perfectionism I talked about how, you know, it can go back into childhood and you agree that you can see all these things and maybe where it kind of started to show itself.

 

00;21;54;16 – 00;22;14;00

Dr. Mona

But also we’re adults and, you know, you’ve had things in your adult life maybe at your job. There’s a sticker for perfectionism, too. I think a lot of corporate America is in that perfectionism mindset. So there’s so many different ways that this can happen. This is such a great conversation. What would be your final take home for everyone listening?

 

00;22;14;03 – 00;22;34;25

Michelle Kenney

Just know that if you have your heart in the right place in your parenting, if you really like, listen to your soul and your heart and what feels good and what feels right, and you have that as your guiding light. You’re going to figure out how to be the best parent for your kid. So if you want to go on social media and get some tips, great.

 

00;22;34;27 – 00;22;37;07

Michelle Kenney

Do. You don’t have to live and die by them. Yeah.

 

00;22;37;09 – 00;22;52;19

Dr. Mona

And that’s so important. Michelle, this was so great. At the end of every episode, I like to ask before we share, you know, all the resources and where people can find you because we’re talking about parenting and you’ve already kind of mentioned some highs and lows, I guess. But what would be like a parenting high and a parenting low?

 

00;22;52;19 – 00;23;06;22

Dr. Mona

I love doing this because I get to know more about my guests. Our listeners can know more about how we are not perfect parents. So this is like the perfect episode to put this in, but I put it in most of my episodes. But what would be your high and low, with your two teenagers now?

 

00;23;06;24 – 00;23;29;20

Michelle Kenney

I mean, I think my lowest point and I mentioned it earlier was really the first time I ever yelled at as me, my oldest. I felt this, like change in my heart, like I hardened immediately when I yelled at her and that hurt my soul. I think deeply and I know it hurt her so and so. I think those few first few times of yelling and screaming at my kids really changed things.

 

00;23;29;20 – 00;23;31;26

Michelle Kenney

And I will always remember that.

 

00;23;31;29 – 00;23;32;27

Dr. Mona

So what about high.

 

00;23;33;02 – 00;23;51;05

Michelle Kenney

And then my high? Recently I asked my oldest, I want her to come on my podcast and she’s like really reluctant to do it. And I’m like, no, come on. Like, let’s share all of our stuff. And she’s like, oh, mom, it’s so embarrassing. And I was like, okay. And she’s like, well, what would we talk about? And I said, well, I would ask you this question.

 

00;23;51;05 – 00;24;03;23

Michelle Kenney

I would say as me, what’s the difference that you see between the relationship that some of your friends parents have with them and the relationship that you and I have? And she, without even hesitating, said, you trust me.

 

00;24;03;25 – 00;24;04;24

Dr. Mona

You know?

 

00;24;04;27 – 00;24;11;25

Michelle Kenney

And I was like, oh, that’s so great, I did it. She believes I trust her and I do. And so that’s what I always wanted.

 

00;24;11;27 – 00;24;29;05

Dr. Mona

Okay, Michelle, you’re going to have to come back on a future episode to talk about how we can create trust in our children, because it sounds easy, but it’s actually not. It’s actually I think there’s a lot of roadblocks that parents do. And I see that’s why you said that. I’m like, this is such a good topic because I think even in toddler years, we don’t trust our toddlers enough.

 

00;24;29;05 – 00;24;48;27

Dr. Mona

Yes. Yeah, I get it. And I think that comes I mean, I know this is going to go to another episode that will record later, but I think it comes because we have to protect our children from a safety standpoint. But there’s so many things that we can let our children do for their own, and also how we allow them to trust their bodies with food, with movement, with when they fall.

 

00;24;48;27 – 00;24;50;28

Dr. Mona

I mean, oh gosh, this is going to be so.

 

00;24;51;03 – 00;24;56;03

Michelle Kenney

Yes, failure. Like letting them fail, let them tell they’re going to fail. It’s okay. It’s good for them to fail.

 

00;24;56;03 – 00;25;13;02

Dr. Mona

And again, this is going back to your perfectionism talk. Right. Because when you don’t fail as a toddler, as a school age kid and never had someone to guide you, you’re going to have what me and you have, which is this perfectionism mindset that we are trying to undo. So yeah. So where can everyone find you? I’m going to have you back on.

 

00;25;13;02 – 00;25;28;27

Dr. Mona

So everyone. Yeah. Yes. This is we have so many topics and I don’t have a lot of repeat guests on because there’s so many people that are like, oh, I’d love to be on. And I’m like, I like to share the podcast, but you and me are vibing right now, and I’m loving the way you talk about parenting and I just love it.

 

00;25;28;27 – 00;25;30;09

Michelle Kenney

So we’re keeping everyone.

 

00;25;30;09 – 00;25;33;10

Dr. Mona

So yeah, we’re kind of I’m peace.

 

00;25;33;10 – 00;25;42;05

Michelle Kenney

And parenting pretty much everywhere. Peace and parenting on Instagram. On Facebook. I’m on what’s I called Tik Tok.

 

00;25;42;08 – 00;25;43;06

Dr. Mona

 

00;25;43;08 – 00;25;50;19

Michelle Kenney

I’m on the internet. Peace and parenting la.com. I’m just kind of everywhere. And I have my own podcast, which is also peace and parenting.

 

00;25;50;22 – 00;25;56;06

Dr. Mona

Love it. And I’m going to be linking all of these resources. I love how you’re like, what’s that called TikTok?

 

00;25;56;13 – 00;25;57;21

Michelle Kenney

I don’t, I like.

 

00;25;57;23 – 00;26;13;11

Dr. Mona

I’m not on it yet, and I know I should because it’s a lot of people are on it, but I just can’t right now. But I love it. I’m going to touch all the links, everyone. Again, Michelle, thank you for joining us. If you love this episode, make sure you tag, for some parents and an Instagram as well.

 

00;26;13;11 – 00;26;24;15

Dr. Mona

As we stocked up on your stories. Share it. Leave a review. Call up Michelle for the wonderful messages that she sent to the on this episode, in the review and ratings. And thank you again for coming on.

 

00;26;24;17 – 00;26;26;04

Michelle Kenney

Thank you so much, man. It was so.

 

00;26;26;04 – 00;26;42;12

Dr. Mona

Lovely. Thank you for tuning in for this week’s episode. As always, please leave a review, share this episode with a friend, share it on your social media. Make sure to follow me at PedsDocTalk on Instagram and subscribe to my YouTube channel, PedsDocTalk TV. We’ll talk to you soon.