It is an honor to welcome Emily Oster who is an economist, mother, and author of the New York Times Bestselling book, Cribsheet, to the podcast today.

Emily’s book Cribsheet: A Data-Driven Guide to Better, More Relaxed Parenting, from Birth to Preschool breaks down so many topics and choices parents struggle with in parenthood.

From deciding to circumcise, sleep train, to introduce screen time, she breaks it all down with the evidence.

I welcome her on this episode to talk about the limitations of breast feeding research.

Breast milk is beneficial, but is it really FAR superior to formula feeding?

We break down the research and discuss if breast is REALLY best.

• https://emilyoster.net/
• https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/572658/cribsheet-by-emily-oster/

Make sure to follow @profemilyoster and @pedsdoctalk on Instagram

00;00;13;28 – 00;00;29;27

Dr. Mona

Welcome to this very special episode because I am welcoming one of my favorite authors. Her name is Emily Oster. She is an economist, mother and author of the New York Times bestselling book Crib Sheet. Thank you for being here today, Emily.

 

00;00;30;00 – 00;00;35;21

Emily Oster

I am so excited to be here. I’m such a fan of your of your work. And I’m just. Yeah, I’m really excited to get to talk.

 

00;00;35;25 – 00;01;03;18

Dr. Mona

You’re a fan. I am obviously a fan. A little background. Crib sheet is one of her books. She also has a book called Expecting Better, but Crib Sheet was recommended to me by one of my followers. I actually didn’t know about the book until I became pregnant and I was like, this looks great! And as a pediatrician, it resonated so much with me for anyone who has not read Crib Sheet, it basically breaks down all of the things in motherhood or parenting that you may have heard some division on.

 

00;01;03;18 – 00;01;22;04

Dr. Mona

So breastfeeding versus formula, sleep training, which method to do something like, you know, potty training or whatever it is. She just talks about circumcision. She talks about everything that you may be deciding on. Has a parent in an evidence based educational economist mind way. So I love it.

 

00;01;22;06 – 00;01;27;11

Emily Oster

Economist mind. That’s like a good I don’t know I can use that. That’s like that’s what I have or.

 

00;01;27;17 – 00;01;44;27

Dr. Mona

It’s so great though. And I love it because it comes from just a place of obviously you’re a mom to, just giving the data, making sure that parents don’t feel guilted with the choices that they make. Because as a pediatrician, that’s my goal, too. We can choose a little combination of everything as a parent, and our kids turn out amazing.

 

00;01;44;27 – 00;02;03;02

Dr. Mona

So we are going to be talking about one of the many topics in her book, Crib Sheet, which is, is breast really best? So we’re going to be breaking down the research, the limitations of the research behind breastfeeding and breast milk, and have just a healthy educational conversation about all this.

 

00;02;03;04 – 00;02;04;06

Emily Oster

Let’s do it.

 

00;02;04;08 – 00;02;11;18

Dr. Mona

So first of all, why did you decide to become an author, obviously after having a career as an economist. And right.

 

00;02;11;21 – 00;02;31;26

Emily Oster

So I actually I wrote expecting Better when I was pregnant with my daughter and really sort of inspired by that experience and the feeling of like, I really want to see what the data says about the kinds of questions I was, I was asking during my, during my pregnancy. And then, and then, you know, a number of years later, I wrote Crib Sheet.

 

00;02;32;07 – 00;02;50;12

Emily Oster

And by that time I actually had had two kids. And so I sort of say like the, the kind of working crib sheet is really inspired by having a second kid because I feel like with my first kid, I was like, everything was was like just took over my mind. Like I was obsessed about every tiny thing.

 

00;02;50;12 – 00;03;09;11

Emily Oster

I we saw this story about the time that, like, I was on the internet, like looking for information about infant mittens because my mom told me that, like, if I put mittens on her, she would never learn to use her hands, which, like, I, I don’t think it’s true. But, but then when I had, you know, when I had a second kid, I think it becomes a little easier.

 

00;03;09;11 – 00;03;24;20

Emily Oster

You don’t have quite as much time. It was like, a little bit easier to sort of focus on what are the really, like, big picture kind of things that I really feel like we have to make decisions about. And then that’s when I wrote Crib Sheet, which is really about a lot of those, those choices and just thinking through, you know, what does the evidence say on this?

 

00;03;24;20 – 00;03;30;24

Emily Oster

And, you know, how should I make a choice in a way that is going to make me happy and is going to work for my family?

 

00;03;30;26 – 00;03;46;27

Dr. Mona

Yeah. And again, that’s why I love this book so much. I actually read it on my babymoon to Hawaii and it was such an easy read. Also. And like I said earlier, as a pediatrician, a lot of the topics I was just agreeing with you, I don’t I hadn’t even met you or know you. And I said, yes, yes, I completely agree.

 

00;03;47;03 – 00;04;03;18

Dr. Mona

Yes, because a lot of that information is all over the place. And again, it was just so beautifully written and there are many topics that you discuss, but tell me more why you chose to dive into the topic of breastfeeding and breast milk research for the book sheet.

 

00;04;03;21 – 00;04;22;29

Emily Oster

Yeah. So I think that there’s sort of two, two big reasons why this gets so much attention in, in the book. And, you know, one is just I think for a lot of new parents and, you know, new moms in particular, this is such a big decision. And it is so, you know, emotionally fraught. And there are so much societal pressure in various directions.

 

00;04;23;11 – 00;04;49;24

Emily Oster

So I think it’s just on a lot of our, a lot of our minds, it also happens to be a place where the evidence is, really mixed, where it’s very easy for people to feel confused about, like what’s real in the, in the science. So it’s it’s both a place that I think is really important and a place where, you know, the particular set of approaches and skills that I bring here seem really relevant.

 

00;04;49;26 – 00;05;12;22

Dr. Mona

Absolutely agree. And let’s talk about the research. And for anyone who’s listening, I want to remind you that we’re just discussing limitations. What the research shows. We’re going to have a healthy discussion about it. We are pro breastfeeding. We’re pro formula feeding. I myself formula fed my son, but I still promote breastfeeding. And I believe Emily did a mixture of breastfeeding and formula feeding.

 

00;05;12;22 – 00;05;28;10

Dr. Mona

So yeah, this is not to say that breastfeeding is not great. This is not to say that formula feeding is not great or better. This is just understanding the research behind breast milk and breastfeeding. So what do you think the limitations of breast milk and breastfeeding research are?

 

00;05;28;12 – 00;05;54;27

Emily Oster

So I think the biggest limitation is that for the most part, the data that we have on this isn’t from, Rand, like what we call randomized trials. And so most of the evidence that you see about breastfeeding is really like comparing, babies from moms who breastfed and moms who did not. And, but those groups tend to be pretty different in, in a lot of other ways.

 

00;05;54;27 – 00;06;12;26

Emily Oster

So like most obvious one is that on average, women with more education breastfeed more than women with less, education. And that’s been true for a long time. There are there are other differences, across these groups. And so I think, you know, it’s really hard to separate the breast milk from all of the other things that are that are different.

 

00;06;12;26 – 00;06;19;21

Emily Oster

And that’s kind of a canonical problem in a lot of things here. But it really, really, really rears up in the case of breastfeeding.

 

00;06;19;23 – 00;06;27;03

Dr. Mona

So let’s talk about some of the general findings on the benefits of breast milk. What have you researched and obviously talked about in your book as well?

 

00;06;27;03 – 00;06;51;06

Emily Oster

So, you know, I think there’s kind of a separate in the book and sort of a couple of different categories. So there’s kind of like the short run benefits. So things like, you know, like breastfeeding is like good for infant health in the first year, you know, things like digestion or ear infections and stuff like that. And, you know, we could talk about it more, but that’s kind of a place where there’s probably is a bit, a bit better evidence of at least maybe some small positive effects.

 

00;06;51;08 – 00;07;15;05

Emily Oster

And then there’s a whole category of things which I think are in many ways, the pieces that kind of stress people out the most, which is this idea that, like, there are these long term effects of breastfeeding that, you know, breast milk is kids who are breastfed are going to be smarter, they’re going to have higher IQs, they’re going to be thinner, or they’re going to be getting sick less, in, you know, when they’re older, they’re going to have all kinds of like long term.

 

00;07;15;08 – 00;07;30;26

Emily Oster

There’s gonna be all kinds of long term stuff, that were there there are benefits. And I think that’s what a lot of moms here, you know, you have to give your kid the best start. It’s the best. It’s the best. And, you know, if you don’t like, you know, you’ve sort of failed at this first thing, that you’re supposed to be doing.

 

00;07;30;26 – 00;07;35;16

Emily Oster

And, that stresses a lot of people stress me out. I don’t know if it stressed you out.

 

00;07;35;18 – 00;07;57;08

Dr. Mona

Oh, it did, but you know what? It did stress me out. But because I understand the limitations of the research that you just mentioned, I know that yes, there is a small, small benefit for breast milk that we of course understand that it’s from mom. It’s breast milk. Does obviously, when a child sick mom’s breast milk changes to, you know, nourish that child for their needs.

 

00;07;57;13 – 00;08;17;10

Dr. Mona

If mom is sick, the breast milk can change. I mean, we know that that that is an awesome thing about breast. Not. But when you look at the long term implications, like you mentioned, I know many formula fed babies who did not have obesity, who don’t, who are very high IQ, who don’t get sick a lot. I’m going to use my husband and myself as an example.

 

00;08;17;22 – 00;08;39;08

Dr. Mona

We both were formula fed babies. And so it was very it was hard to make that choice because I said, you know what? I would like to do this thing. I want to experience breast breastfeeding for what it is. You know, I want to try it. But for 24 hours, I was sad with my decision. But once I realized, you know, how healthy my son was and understanding, hey, there are limitations.

 

00;08;39;13 – 00;08;58;09

Dr. Mona

We are going to provide our son with so much in his life that is going to make it that he won’t even ever remember. He won’t. We won’t even know that he was breastfed or not. Right? So we talk about IQ and you said it perfectly that when they do the research studies, they’re not looking at the IQ of the parents per se.

 

00;08;58;09 – 00;09;26;20

Dr. Mona

Right. Maybe the breastfed moms were higher IQ to begin with. And maybe the formula fed moms had a slightly lower IQ. Understanding socioeconomic levels, understanding the people who do breastfeed. But what about a family like ours who is a two doctor family who? You can say that we probably have a pretty decent IQ formula, said their child. We’re not understanding the genetics that come in to our intellect, to our weight, to our immune system.

 

00;09;26;25 – 00;09;46;08

Dr. Mona

And that is not just how we are fed. And that is the big thing I want people to understand because our son eats a variety of different foods, spices. That’s amazing for his immune system. Sure, he may get an ear infection, but I’m not going to blame it on the fact that I didn’t breastfeed my son because a lot of kids get ear infections, including kids who are breastfed.

 

00;09;46;10 – 00;10;08;18

Emily Oster

No. Totally. Right. And I think what really resonates there is, is sort of when you see this, when we talk about this, we we sort of people like talk about it as if the, the effects are like, ignore even the the possible effects are enormous. And we sort of have to say, like, even if there was some small effect on IQ, which just to be clear, not nothing in the evidence would particularly support.

 

00;10;08;22 – 00;10;28;21

Emily Oster

Right. It it’s going to be tiny relative to the impacts of everything else about, you know, the genetics and the other things you do and all of the other things that happened to your kid. And like it just like all of these things we’re talking about are really, really small. And and, you know, there are there are things sort of weighing in the other, you know, weighing in the other direction.

 

00;10;29;09 – 00;10;54;25

Emily Oster

And I think that sometimes we can get really wrapped up in breastfeeding with sort of like, well, I like I failed and then people can get very, can get very sad and it can really affect, you know, the way that they interact with the early period of their baby’s life when when you look back on it and you sort of think, I mean, you’re you’re still like a little your kids, still fairly little like my kids are five and nine and when I look back now, it’s like, and I look at their friends like nobody.

 

00;10;54;28 – 00;11;06;21

Emily Oster

I have no idea who was who was breastfed. This isn’t like this. This is seems so important in the moment. But in the in the aggregate, it’s it’s kind of like a, it’s a pretty small thing relative to every other thing.

 

00;11;07;08 – 00;11;36;17

Dr. Mona

And you said it perfectly like when you are so wrapped up in the decision, just so you made a choice not to breastfeed, and it was what you wanted to do. And that and the emotions that come with that. And if you are, you’re allowed to feel those emotions because I did too. But I want if you make that choice to formula feed and it was something that was hard for you, I want you to say, okay, I, I’m sad about this, but we’re going to move forward because if you like Emily said, like if you live in those emotions, you are taking away from all of the protective things that help enrich your

 

00;11;36;17 – 00;12;02;14

Dr. Mona

child. Like we said, developmentally engaging with your child, reading to them, talking with them, playing with them, that is also very helpful for their development. The foods that we give them, everything that we do besides how we feed our babies, their formula, our breast milk in the first year or two of life is so much more protective and has a lot more of an impact on what Emily’s saying, those long term things that the research is saying, and I can’t stress it enough.

 

00;12;02;14 – 00;12;26;00

Dr. Mona

The problem I have with the research is that there just are not understanding that, yes, by nature, we know this, that formula fed mothers tend to be of a lower socioeconomic status. That does not mean that all mothers who formula feed are. But when we look at the data, right, we we know that. But that doesn’t mean that a mother who formula fed their child is going to turn out to have a low IQ.

 

00;12;26;00 – 00;12;34;11

Dr. Mona

And it does not mean that if you breastfed your child that your child was going to have a high IQ. So there’s so many other factors in parenting.

 

00;12;34;13 – 00;12;48;04

Emily Oster

Yeah, I mean, I think some of my favorite, some of the best studies of this are things where they look at like two siblings, where one is breastfed and one is not. And, you know, you can think people are like, well, why would that happen? It’s like, well, I don’t know, like there was a medical issue. So you didn’t breastfeed one of them?

 

00;12;48;12 – 00;13;07;23

Emily Oster

You know, a medical issue with mom or, you know, it was the second kid and you didn’t do it or was a second kid, and you did do it. Just, you know, something, something happened. And and there you really don’t see any differences. So there’s two there are two siblings. You’re not seeing any differences in IQ, in in obesity, in any of these kind of things across the siblings.

 

00;13;07;27 – 00;13;26;29

Emily Oster

And it really, really does look like it’s sort of it’s differences across the moms, whether it’s in education or IQ or other things that are kind of driving the differences we see across families and within families. Those just sort of disappear. And I think that’s, you know, that’s pretty convincing evidence that there’s a lot of things that matter in your family.

 

00;13;26;29 – 00;13;31;26

Emily Oster

This particular thing is not driving those those outcomes.

 

00;13;31;29 – 00;13;44;08

Dr. Mona

And I know there is obviously some data showing that when you are looking at benefit, breast milk does help with I think the biggest thing was like neck, which is something in the nick period. You want explain a little bit about that. Yeah.

 

00;13;44;08 – 00;13;56;19

Emily Oster

So I think, you know, a much of their like this sort of early life stuff. There are more pieces where it looks like there are there are benefits. And so the most striking one is neck. The you’re going to be able to be better at.

 

00;13;56;20 – 00;14;08;05

Dr. Mona

Your neck necrotizing enterocolitis, which is a, a condition in mainly premature babies. In the Nikki, where basically their blood supply to their bowel shuts off. So we continue.

 

00;14;08;06 – 00;14;33;11

Emily Oster

Yeah. Yeah. And so and there you do see that that, that breast milk either, you know, from or from a donor is actually better leads to less, less likelihood of that complication. Then then formula which I, you know, I think is, is consistent with kind of our understanding that this is an easier to digest food. And you see maybe a little bit of a hint of some of that digestion in, you know, the impacts on like gastrointestinal illnesses, even in healthy babies in the first year of life.

 

00;14;33;11 – 00;14;53;09

Emily Oster

But again, that’s a sort of very so that that is a benefit of the question. But it’s it’s also a relatively short term kind of like thing that is really closely linked to the moment of, of breastfeeding as opposed to this idea that kind of in that there’s like this long term, you know, thing, the way in which you’re failing your, your baby.

 

00;14;53;15 – 00;14;53;29

Emily Oster

Yeah.

 

00;14;54;03 – 00;15;11;03

Dr. Mona

And I think that’s the message here. It’s my message is for, you know, if a breastfed mom is breastfeeding, I want you to know that that’s awesome. But if you choose to formula feed your baby. Hey, that’s actually pretty awesome too, because there are other things that we can do. And that kind of is what made me feel comfortable with my choice.

 

00;15;11;03 – 00;15;29;01

Dr. Mona

I mean, I, as you know, I have that following on Instagram and so many mothers would message me or, you know, DM me and say, thank you for sharing your story about doing formula feeding. And I forget that it is kind of a story because it’s a choice that many mothers still feel guilted for. And I said, I am making the best choice for myself and for my son.

 

00;15;29;06 – 00;15;55;07

Dr. Mona

This is what I’m doing, and my story helps you make the choice and feel happy with your choice. That is what I want because I don’t want parents to just feel and live in that guilt for so long, because their children will turn out awesome with the environment that they are in. Now, if you could design a study to assess the benefits of breastfeeding, what would you consider like if you were to, you know, kind of what we talked about rehash, how would you design a study or what would you consider in that?

 

00;15;55;09 – 00;16;12;12

Emily Oster

Yeah, I mean, I think part of what’s really hard is that what any effects that we’re going to see, I think we know from the existing data are likely to be small. And so the first thing in my study is it would need to be really, really big. Because you need like a lot of people. And the other thing is you can’t actually force people to breastfeed or not.

 

00;16;12;12 – 00;16;40;29

Emily Oster

So any kind of study you would design of this, you would need to like encourage people to breastfeed versus not. But I will say what I think, where I think I would want to go with this is we still see pretty large socioeconomic status gaps, particularly racial gaps, in breastfeeding, within the, within the U.S, and those gaps are in breastfeeding, like we’re seeing people initiate breastfeeding in the hospital and then not continue even a few weeks out.

 

00;16;41;02 – 00;17;11;26

Emily Oster

And if we kind of think about where to the extent that there are benefits, where are they occurring? They’re probably occurring most in the first few weeks. So I think if I were to do a study, I think I would really focus on that, on sort of being in hospital, like providing support to help women, like continue breastfeeding even through it through a few weeks and then following up, really focus on some of this kind of early life health stuff rather than focusing on these long term things and, and try to see, you know, if we can kind of move the needle a little bit on, on some of that.

 

00;17;11;26 – 00;17;23;22

Emily Oster

And honestly, like also help people who want to breastfeed but, but struggle to do it because I think the other thing we never talk about very much is like, it’s actually really hard. Yeah. It’s just really hard. I found it really hard.

 

00;17;23;25 – 00;17;26;20

Dr. Mona

And you said you did a mix, right? You did some pumping, some formula.

 

00;17;26;25 – 00;17;40;03

Emily Oster

Yeah. I think, you know, with my with my daughter, I did, I, we like, had a lot of, I had a lot of supply issues. And so I pumped that I fed her some and I fed her some formula. And my son, it was like a little bit easier because, I don’t know, it’s a second. It’s a second kid.

 

00;17;40;03 – 00;18;00;10

Emily Oster

But we still eventually, eventually did some formula because my, like, pumping supply just wasn’t that wasn’t that good. And I actually I, you know, I remember I felt like when we finally quit breastfeeding because he, he bit me, and I had, like, a negative reaction to it, of course, because he bit me. Yeah. And, and then I, and I sort of was like, and then he was just.

 

00;18;00;10 – 00;18;06;00

Emily Oster

And then basically after he was like 9 or 10 months old and he got really upset and then that’s it. He would never do it again.

 

00;18;06;02 – 00;18;07;03

Dr. Mona

No. Oh.

 

00;18;07;05 – 00;18;25;24

Emily Oster

And I remember like at the time being really sad and being like, oh my God, I like did this thing. I shouldn’t have reacted like that. But now when I look back on it, it’s like, you know, from like now that like that’s a person who can read, you know, and it’s like it’s it’s just so not, you know, it sort of doesn’t have the emotional valence that it that it did.

 

00;18;25;26 – 00;18;43;25

Dr. Mona

Well, that’s a good example because I get that a lot in my office where I’ll have a mom come in who is is really not enjoying the pumping process, you know, trying to get what she can and the babies now, you know, eight, eight months, seven months. And she’s like, doctor, is it okay if I stop? I mean, I’m not producing.

 

00;18;43;28 – 00;19;05;22

Dr. Mona

I’m so tired. Is the baby still going to have the protective benefits? And, you know, if I’m only giving 30% breast milk or, you know, 70% formula and I say I’m like, mom, you need to do what’s best for you. I mean, you are giving your baby nutrition of some kind, and that’s what makes me happy. The fact that you’re even giving 30% awesome, even if you give 10% or zero, whatever makes you happy.

 

00;19;05;22 – 00;19;23;00

Dr. Mona

And. But it’s that sentiment, right? It’s that what you just said, that that guilt of, oh my gosh, is it okay if I’m only even doing this much? Is that child going to turn out to be obese or have a low IQ and, you know, be more sick? And I don’t want moms to feel that because, yeah, it’s so much stress, especially like you said in that first year of life.

 

00;19;23;05 – 00;19;43;24

Dr. Mona

You know, I haven’t really said this story. And I on my Instagram or maybe on another podcast, but I am very pro breastfeeding. And before I have Ryan, I had a misconception, which I’m going to say right now, I said that I can do it as long as I put my mind to it, I’m going to work really hard and I’m going to breastfeed my son.

 

00;19;43;26 – 00;19;45;05

Emily Oster

Get a win.

 

00;19;45;08 – 00;19;56;18

Dr. Mona

Win. My type B personality is going to make this happen. I will make it happen. Whatever needs to do, whatever needs to happen. And to be honest, that mentality was not going to make me successful.

 

00;19;56;18 – 00;19;58;01

Emily Oster

Breastfeeding was not helpful.

 

00;19;58;01 – 00;20;15;29

Dr. Mona

I don’t know, because I struggled. I mean, I for anyone who doesn’t know my story, I was in ICU, my son was in the ICU. I was sick and waking myself up to pump every three hours, and I was miserable. And I said I would watch those little drops of colostrum come and I would get so excited. I’d show my husband, I would show my sister.

 

00;20;16;03 – 00;20;38;24

Dr. Mona

And then finally, when I was like, slated to go back to the O.R. for a procedure after my C-section, I was like, no, I’m done. I can’t do it. And I, I look at that whole story and I talk to my husband about this. He’s like, do you ever regret not trying more? And I say, no, I’m like, I almost feel like for me to be a breastfeeding loving pediatrician who formula fed her son is what my gift is to the world.

 

00;20;38;24 – 00;20;58;29

Dr. Mona

It’s like what my gift is to the world to say, you know what? Yeah, you can still support breastfeeding and support moms, but have formula for your own child and support when another mother wants to go that route too. And I think that’s what we need a little bit more of. You know, I love lactation consultant, but I want lactation consultants to also understand that at some point the mother may reach their limit.

 

00;20;58;29 – 00;21;16;24

Dr. Mona

And I don’t want that mother to feel that they’re not supported in that decision. I don’t want them to feel like they’re making a bad decision by ending it. And I hate using that word. I shouldn’t, but that, you know, transitioning to another way of feeding their baby. But yeah, it’s it’s so important because there’s so many different ways to feed your baby.

 

00;21;16;24 – 00;21;33;01

Dr. Mona

And you’re like, I love Ryan. I look at him, and I can’t even imagine that. I worried about that. You know? It’s like he’s a thriving young boy who’s so bright and I’m like, oh, it’s just it’s I want all the moms listening who ever worry about that decision to know that they’re supported.

 

00;21;33;03 – 00;21;47;28

Emily Oster

Yeah, I totally agree with that. And I think the other, you know, I think there’s also a sort of flip side of this, which is like we kind of simultaneously tell women like, you know, the breastfeeding is the most important thing. And then we make it like quite hard. Not just that it’s already hard to do, but it’s like, well, you know, it’s so important to do that.

 

00;21;47;28 – 00;22;02;20

Emily Oster

But don’t show me your boobs. Yeah. Because I don’t want to see, you know, and I think part of, for me, part of what made it go much easier with my son, I mean, part of is just the second kid is easier, but part of it is I just at some point was like, you know what? Like I’m just going to I’m like, I’m not getting any nursing covers.

 

00;22;02;20 – 00;22;25;01

Emily Oster

You know, I’m just going to like, do it wherever. And it actually was much easier because some of like some of the most difficult struggles I had with my daughter was when I was trying to like, you know, be in a hot closet or something. So people didn’t see me. And, and I think that we sort of we could, we could really balance, like, simultaneously like, let’s make it possible for people to do this if it works for them and it’s what they want.

 

00;22;25;03 – 00;22;36;25

Emily Oster

And then at the same time, let’s just like make it clear that all these other options are also great and that, like, there’s a lot of great ways to do this. And we should be sort of like broadly supportive of all of them.

 

00;22;37;05 – 00;22;41;17

Dr. Mona

I wish we had, more time to talk about all the different topics in your book, all.

 

00;22;41;17 – 00;22;43;09

Emily Oster

The different things, because I have to come back.

 

00;22;43;10 – 00;23;02;21

Dr. Mona

I know you are. And I when you emailed me back and said, I’m a fan and I want to be on your podcast, I literally like I think I shared it to my Instagram story because again, I just love talking about this with you from just a reasonable middle ground, common sense way of parenting. You know, this is what we need way more of, in this world.

 

00;23;02;21 – 00;23;19;08

Dr. Mona

You know, I think there is not there should not be this black and white. I have to do this. And if I don’t do this and this is going to happen. So you’re amazing. What would be your final take home message for breastfeeding moms? Moms who are doing both moms who choose to formula feed. What would be your message for all of these mothers?

 

00;23;19;14 – 00;23;24;05

Emily Oster

You’re doing good job. Oh, I love it. I just you are, you are.

 

00;23;24;05 – 00;23;41;05

Dr. Mona

Great job. You’re doing a great job and your child will turn out amazing with your love and the environment that you give them. Okay, I can’t stress that enough. And if I can be that example for any of my mothers who struggle with the decision to formula feed their child, I hope I can give that to you. I’m.

 

00;23;41;09 – 00;24;00;26

Dr. Mona

I’m hoping to have another child. You know, my husband and I would love to add to our family. And like you, Emily, I’m hoping that with my second that I can maybe breastfeed and it’s just going to be a choice I make with like, hey, I want to try this, but if I don’t do it, or if I choose to do formula, I’m going to tell myself, well, I’ve made the choice that’s best for me, and I want every mother to make the choice.

 

00;24;00;26 – 00;24;01;15

Dr. Mona

It’s best for them.

 

00;24;01;15 – 00;24;03;12

Emily Oster

To do that is so,

 

00;24;03;15 – 00;24;25;21

Dr. Mona

Well, thank you so much. You are definitely having. You’re going to come back again. I’m. I’m happy that that’s an open invitation for you and everyone. I will attach a link to her book and any other links that Emily wants to add for her website and whatnot. I know you actually, right now are heavily involved in Covid in terms of giving information on schools and other things regarding Covid data, correct?

 

00;24;25;21 – 00;24;34;25

Emily Oster

Yeah, I am, so I’ll give you a I’ll send I’ll send you a link to my, to my newsletter where I talk a lot about that, that kind of stuff. And do a lot of Covid, Covid Covid, Covid all the time is, is.

 

00;24;34;26 – 00;24;51;24

Dr. Mona

We we chose not to talk about Covid because I know everyone is that’s on your mind, but later we can have her come on again to talk about Covid. But I’m going to touch that in case you all are interested in this sort of, you know, viewpoint on data driven parenting. So thank you so much, Emily, for coming on today.

 

00;24;51;27 – 00;24;54;22

Emily Oster

Thank you so much. Such a treat.

 

00;24;54;25 – 00;25;10;17

Dr. Mona

Thank you for tuning in for this week’s episode. As always, please leave a review, share this episode with a friend, share it on your social media. Make sure to follow me at PedsDocTalk on Instagram and subscribe to my YouTube channel, PedsDocTalk TV. We’ll talk to you soon.