OOOF. Toddler or child aggression: biting, kicking, hitting.. It can all seem overwhelming to manage, but how much is too much? I welcome Joia, a mom from the PDT community to chat with how much is too much when it comes to aggression. Listen in as we discuss:

• How to manage aggression
• Missteps to avoid
• When is toddler aggression a concern

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00;00;00;00 – 00;00;17;18

Dr. Mona

He doesn’t know if he wants a hug. He doesn’t know if he wants to hit you. He doesn’t know his body right now is taking all of his emotions and doing what he just feels is right. Which is let me take all my emotions. And either for some kids, throw myself on the ground and for other children the aggression, right?

 

00;00;17;18 – 00;00;22;24

Dr. Mona

The physical act of my emotions.

 

00;00;22;26 – 00;00;47;09

Dr. Mona

Welcome back to the show. I am Doctor Mona and we are here because of you. Your reviews, the way that you share these episodes. This is how the PedsDocTalk podcast continues to grow. And I know 2023 is going to be our best year yet. So in order for us to continue this momentum, you have to continue leading those reviews and sharing this podcast on this episode of Monday Mornings with Doctor Mona.

 

00;00;47;10 – 00;01;14;14

Dr. Mona

I welcome Joia, who is a mother of a two and a half year old, almost three year old, and we’re chatting all about his aggression. Is his aggression normal and also strategies to managing that aggressive child. So tune in for the conversation. Hey Joy, thank you so much for joining me on today’s show. Tell me what is on your mind today as a mom.

 

00;01;14;17 – 00;01;27;08

Joia

So I have an almost three year old a few months from now, and he’s just very aggressive and active. So he loves to hit and poke and grab and all the things, and it seems never ending. And I’m just wondering if that’s normal.

 

00;01;27;21 – 00;01;48;05

Dr. Mona

Yes. I’m so glad that we could chat about this because toddlers by nature can be very aggressive in terms of the poking, the grabbing, the hitting, all of that stuff that you’re describing, because it’s a very, almost innate thing that that’s how they kind of communicate and get attention and also just express their emotional desires through physical acts of, you know, hitting, kicking all of the stuff that you said.

 

00;01;48;09 – 00;01;54;24

Dr. Mona

But yes, there is a question of how much is too much and when is it not becoming normal, and how old is your child?

 

00;01;54;26 – 00;01;58;16

Joia

He’s just passed two years, eight months. So he’ll be okay the beginning of May.

 

00;01;58;18 – 00;02;13;16

Dr. Mona

Yeah. And so when we get into this discussion, knowing the age is very important too, right? Because a two years, eight months. Absolutely. This could be in line. But we’ll get into more when we talk about this. A five, six year old. Right. It would be a little bit different. But let’s get into it a little bit deeper.

 

00;02;13;22 – 00;02;25;20

Dr. Mona

What has been, I guess, the hardest or most frustrating aspect of this because, you know, like I like having moms. Come on. Because we get to chat about the real deal, not just the information, but why is this hard for you?

 

00;02;25;22 – 00;02;40;26

Joia

It’s hard because I feel like we’re doing everything we’ve been able to do. We’ve talked to the pediatrician, we’ve implemented tips from your podcasts and other influencers, and I feel like we’re doing everything we can. And I just don’t know if I’m missing something. Or is he just doomed to be this very mean child?

 

00;02;40;28 – 00;02;42;16

Dr. Mona

No. You know what?

 

00;02;42;20 – 00;02;58;08

Joia

He’s a great kid. I, I feel like I’m not doing enough to either hear him or understand him. And there’s something that we’re not doing and not picking up on, and that’s concerning. So I just want to make sure it’s normal. Yeah. How can we do better to make sure that we’re treating him the best way we can?

 

00;02;58;10 – 00;03;19;13

Dr. Mona

And so many times with our children, when they’re going through anything, whether it’s a medical issue, whether it’s a behavioral concern, that is a common thing that I think every parent can relate to is that, am I doing enough? Am I doing, you know, crossing my t’s, dotting my eyes. And you are, you know, not only are you consuming information from obviously my resources, but other resources as well.

 

00;03;19;14 – 00;03;35;15

Dr. Mona

Talking to your pediatrician. But you’re taking your time today to really chat with me, which I really appreciate. And I know you’re doing a lot of the mental work when you’re not even looking things up, right? Like thinking about, hey, what do I do in this situation? Should we pivot? Should we change something? Is it something that we can do?

 

00;03;35;15 – 00;03;53;23

Dr. Mona

And many times it’s, you know, getting to the conversation of do we need that extra evaluation, that extra help, whether it’s with this issue or whether it’s with speech or whether it’s with something else related to our child? And that is what I like to advocate for, that this is why those resources exist, right. So we’ll get into that.

 

00;03;54;00 – 00;04;16;25

Dr. Mona

Now I want to ask because, you know, two years, eight months, right? At the time of this recording for your child’s age. Developmentally, we are seeing in terms of milestones, like reaching social milestones, like how he interacts with you. Also more so like language, communication and cognitive like understanding, like being able to put puzzle pieces together or, you know, stack cups or play with toys appropriately.

 

00;04;16;26 – 00;04;18;19

Dr. Mona

Are we seeing that with him?

 

00;04;18;21 – 00;04;22;25

Joia

Yes, I think some on par for language and mental and cognitive development.

 

00;04;22;25 – 00;04;28;07

Dr. Mona

Yes. Perfect. And then in terms of school, he does attend a preschool. Correct?

 

00;04;28;09 – 00;04;29;23

Joia

He does. He’s in full time daycare.

 

00;04;29;24 – 00;04;37;08

Dr. Mona

Yes. Yeah. And how is his aggression concerns there? Do you feel like they’re similar works better than what they are at home?

 

00;04;37;11 – 00;04;43;14

Joia

Similar. He tends to be the worst with mom, but he is similar in general at daycare as well.

 

00;04;43;17 – 00;05;18;06

Dr. Mona

Okay, so this is all really important background information when we kind of decide, okay, how much is too much? One is the developmental question that I had. I’m really happy to hear that there is things that are going, you know, according to milestones before we even chat, let’s talk about this earlier, is if we’re dealing with a situation where there’s concern with development, perhaps delayed language, perhaps motor skills, perhaps cognitive development, there definitely is a conversation on is this some sort of developmental concern, such as autism or something with neurodiversity?

 

00;05;18;11 – 00;05;46;03

Dr. Mona

Because we want to just make sure, if that’s the case, that we do get the resources appropriate for that child’s neurodiversity. Because when a child is neurodiverse, a neurodiversity for anyone who’s unfamiliar is our brain works a little bit differently. And all of us, in a way, are diverse in the way our brains work. But when we talk about neurodiversity, these are things like autism, ADHD, sensory processing disorders that maybe there is something that we need to add for that child informs of official therapy.

 

00;05;46;03 – 00;06;02;15

Dr. Mona

It sounds like we don’t need any speech for your child. It sounds like he’s on PA. So this is also good to hear when we continue this discussion. Yeah. And in terms of how you have been approaching a situation. So I would love to hear like I have a feeling you’re doing everything because you just said you were.

 

00;06;02;21 – 00;06;07;15

Dr. Mona

But let’s say you’re with him and he throws what is happening in those situations.

 

00;06;07;17 – 00;06;09;02

Joia

I mean what caused it or what are we doing.

 

00;06;09;09 – 00;06;17;12

Dr. Mona

Let’s do what caused it. Like an example, like the last time it happened, like, what was the trigger if there was one? And then how did you all handle it? Yes, exactly.

 

00;06;17;15 – 00;06;20;24

Joia

A common trigger might be. I mean, we’re we’re in potty training mode.

 

00;06;20;28 – 00;06;21;17

Dr. Mona

Oh, yes.

 

00;06;22;10 – 00;06;43;16

Joia

Still working on some of the parts of it, but at will tell him he’s not very good at self initiating. So we’ll try to go potty. Benji and he will take his toy. Just throw it across the room. Natural consequence. He loses the toy gets put away, becomes a tantrum. Ultimately he will go to the potty or we do the one, 2 or 3 magic techniques sometimes or will count to three and a timeout.

 

00;06;43;18 – 00;06;58;20

Joia

He’ll scream that entire two minutes and then he’ll be over it. And we don’t address it at the moment, because it’s not the time to do that when he’s anxious, but eventually he’ll go potty and that’s the end of that. So it’s a little bit of he didn’t get his way and that’s understandable. But we’re putting it down and he didn’t like it.

 

00;06;58;20 – 00;07;10;16

Joia

So he throws it and I try to handle it calmly. I think where we’re not screaming back at him to say no doesn’t help the situation, but that’s where we land and it’s just kind of lather, rinse, repeat all day, every day.

 

00;07;10;18 – 00;07;35;05

Dr. Mona

Yeah, there’s definitely no aggression from your guys’s standpoint. Correct. Like obviously there’s no hitting, there’s no bite. There’s nothing going back at him. Correct? Correct. Yes okay, I assume so. But I just want to make sure that is something extremely important and right that there is in any parenting situation. If a child is being aggressive, hitting, kicking, biting, that we’re not using any sort of physical reprimanding or physical threats situation, that’s very, very important.

 

00;07;35;06 – 00;07;52;12

Dr. Mona

Now let’s talk about the timeout situation. Is it a natural consequence situation or related where it’s like, hey, you threw the toy, it’s time to take a little break and it’s time to take a little time out for ourselves. Or is it a if you do this again, you’re getting a timeout. What would you say that it’s kind of gearing towards for the timeouts?

 

00;07;52;14 – 00;08;06;24

Joia

I think in that situation described, it’s both a natural consequence. The toy gets taken away, don’t throw our toys. And then when he continues to tantrum and not do what he was asked to do, that’s when we start the counting that he knows. Now we’ve moved on from one issue to the next. That makes sense.

 

00;08;06;26 – 00;08;24;11

Dr. Mona

Yes. So one thing I will say that what we can try to do, I don’t mind the counting strategy, but I wonder if in a child who authorities kind of in this sort of aggressive cycle, do you feel like that makes him nervous. I don’t know if you can tell, but do you feel like it makes him like, more agitated when there’s counting happening?

 

00;08;24;14 – 00;08;29;01

Joia

Oh, definitely. Because I. Yeah. You get scared. Yeah. We get to three and there’s a timeout. And he said yeah.

 

00;08;29;03 – 00;08;49;11

Dr. Mona

Like, yeah I know there’s so many different methods out there in a situation where we’re dealing with a child who is in an aggressive kind of cycle, you already did your natural consequence of the, hey, you threw your toy. I have to take the toy away and then you take the toy away. And if he ends up continuously throwing himself on the ground, then we obviously deal with that with, hey, I see that you’re really upset.

 

00;08;49;11 – 00;09;03;20

Dr. Mona

I want you to take your time. I’m right here versus the counting because I do believe that the counting can be very stressful to the child who is more like, oh my gosh, like, this is not something I want to do. Like I don’t want to be in timeout. Like it’s scary. It’s like, I don’t want to do that.

 

00;09;03;20 – 00;09;21;00

Dr. Mona

Right. If we’re going to do a timeout, I would do it in the way where we say, hey, you threw a toy, you do the natural consequence and he still is not listening. Hey, you threw your toy. I think it’s time that we take a little time for ourselves. It’s almost like that’s how we cycle into the timeout versus the one, two, three counting.

 

00;09;21;00 – 00;09;36;25

Dr. Mona

It’s like, hey, you did this. So now we’re going to go take a moment to decompress. That’s kind of how I like to look at timeouts as not a it’s going to happen. You better be ready. It’s more like hey this happened. So let’s all just take a moment and we’re going to sit and you sit with him.

 

00;09;37;00 – 00;09;51;17

Dr. Mona

And I kind of do like a modified timeout time in where it’s like, hey, you can take a moment, sit on this chair. I’m right here. I’m not like leaving the house. I’m going to be here with you, but you just need a moment. And maybe I need a little moment to to just breathe it out, compose ourselves.

 

00;09;51;21 – 00;10;17;13

Dr. Mona

And that’s kind of how I would pivot those moments of how we are using the timeout. More so as a here’s what’s happening versus a hey, countdown, let’s do this right, because that can actually feel to the toddler brain as a threat, meaning, oh my gosh, like this is happening. Like the 123 method. I see it happen like I see it work for some children, but if it’s not and we’ve tried it, then I would say let’s try to pivot to something more.

 

00;10;17;19 – 00;10;33;21

Dr. Mona

Okay, here’s what we’re going to do is there are a lot of around these times of big feelings, aggression. Does he have a desire for physical touch, or is he more of that child who wants to push away when he’s feeling overwhelmed? Because there is a reality that some kids can be like that?

 

00;10;33;24 – 00;10;51;14

Joia

I’m not quite sure how to answer. And here’s why. If he starts to come at me, he likes to pinch me, grab me, whatever. I will remove myself, say, okay, we don’t get, you know, keep your body to yourself. Mommy’s going to move away. And if I move away, he charges at me and comes in. But if I try to grab him and say, okay, let me just hold you, let me calm you down.

 

00;10;51;14 – 00;10;56;07

Joia

He pushes and tries to get away. So it’s an interesting push pull dynamic. Yeah.

 

00;10;56;10 – 00;11;16;07

Dr. Mona

I love that we’re having this conversation because I don’t think on a lot of resources out there, they don’t talk about this scenario of that child who’s in the middle, like, and I’ve been there, I’ve been with a child who I’m trying to give the physical love and attention and hold space with them. But then he pushes and then, like you said the other times, like they’re like all over you and you’re like, okay, what’s happening?

 

00;11;16;10 – 00;11;47;09

Dr. Mona

So here’s what I want you to kind of consider in this situation, his brain is very dysregulated at this moment. Right? We have to respect the fact that he does not know what he technically wants in dysregulation. Correct. So he doesn’t know if he wants a hug. He doesn’t know if he wants to hit you. His body right now is taking all of his emotions and doing what he just feels is right, which is let me take all my emotions and either for some kids, throw myself on the ground and for other children the aggression, right?

 

00;11;47;09 – 00;12;06;07

Dr. Mona

The physical act of my emotions. That’s kind of how I like to describe this, right? This is him trying to communicate with you that I’m very upset at this situation. And even though I have language, my toddler brain, which is very natural for a two year eight month old, does not know how to process all of this stuff happening and I’m just going to hit.

 

00;12;06;14 – 00;12;30;00

Dr. Mona

So I do like the situation where I will always, always, even when Ryan went through a phase of being like very upset and starting to kind of pound on the chest situation, if you’re physically able to hold him in a big bear hug. I do like that as a preference until the body calms down. And one thing to say when you are holding him and I’m sure you’ve done this, is the words and tone that you’re using.

 

00;12;30;03 – 00;12;53;09

Dr. Mona

I get that you’re upset. I get that you’re dysregulated. I understand all this is happening, but I’m going to hold you until your body relaxes in my arms. Right? And if you are feeling unsafe and I have to be clear here, if you’re feeling like he’s going to truly hurt you because they can be strong. Giving example, like maybe at a surgery, maybe you hurt your leg or you can’t sit on the ground like there’s certain situations where you can’t hold a two and a half year old and you’re going to feel like you’re going to get hurt.

 

00;12;53;16 – 00;13;09;01

Dr. Mona

And in that situation, what I would want is what you just said you were going to move yourself and you’re going to protect your body and say, hey, sweetie, I’m going to protect myself like you are. I love you and I’m here for you. I know you’re very upset right now and like you said, but I will not let you hit me.

 

00;13;09;04 – 00;13;26;04

Dr. Mona

But I’m not leaving you because in times of aggression, it’s really hard with our children because you don’t want to get hurt. I agree with you. You don’t want to get hurt, but you have to kind of, in a way protect your body, protect your space, but also make them either through the hug or through you, not leaving them.

 

00;13;26;07 – 00;13;43;08

Dr. Mona

Understand that I am not going to leave you in your time of vulnerability. Like even if it means, let’s say you have a living room and you’re putting him in a chair for a modified time out and saying, I know you’re really upset. I’m going to take a moment. Mommy’s going to step back right here until you’re feeling better.

 

00;13;43;08 – 00;13;59;11

Dr. Mona

But if you need a hug, I’m here. And I would get in the cycle of if you need a hug, I’m here. If you need some space, you can have it too. We did this a lot early on because Ryan also went through it early, like very early with the more physical tantrums, and at first he had no idea.

 

00;13;59;14 – 00;14;15;04

Dr. Mona

He was like, I don’t know if I want a hug, I don’t know what I want. But with the repetition, they finally as they get older, they start to realize, actually, you know what? I maybe do want this hug. Like maybe that’s what’s going to make me feel better. And it’s our responsibility to offer it, but also protect ourselves.

 

00;14;15;04 – 00;14;37;27

Dr. Mona

And I respect that, but also just repeating it. I see that you’re upset. You can either take your time or I can give you a hug. Right? And that’s what’s going to help a lot with that sort of emotional safety that I think he kind of needs right now when he’s feeling dysregulated. And you know, that one, two, three and also all the things that we add can also escalate you right when you start to calm down, like it can feel the whole situation’s escalating.

 

00;14;37;27 – 00;15;04;06

Dr. Mona

What we’re trying to do here is de-escalate an escalated child, right? We’re trying to get him to a point. We’re letting the storm pass. And that is on us to kind of say, how am I going to protect my body? But also how am I going to let this child know that I am not going to go anywhere, or when he’s upset, like I’m actually going to either be face to face with him if he’s not punching me in the face, or how am I going to, like, be in the same space or vicinity, but also protect my body?

 

00;15;04;06 – 00;15;18;29

Dr. Mona

And I think that is going to be, I think, a big thing that you’ll see, you know, he’s two and a half or two years, eight months. In the next six months, there is a lot of developmental change that’s going to happen. And I think a lot of that change is starting to really, really connect all of this that we’re putting together right now.

 

00;15;18;29 – 00;15;41;01

Dr. Mona

My caregiver is there with me. Even though I’m upset, they’re they still love me. They still love me. And that is something that I want to continue to add is the praise and the love and the positive reinforcement when the aggression is not happening. Right. So that they always remember that even though they’re having these really big moments, and it’s not easy for us that I’m going to praise you for other small things.

 

00;15;41;01 – 00;15;59;18

Dr. Mona

Whether he helped you put a sink in the dish, whether he did all these little things in the day, I want you to feel his brain and those neurons with all the things that he is doing right. You are so gentle with mommy. You gave me a hug and it made me feel really good. You gave the dog a big pat on the back and that is so sweet.

 

00;15;59;18 – 00;16;27;29

Dr. Mona

You want to really pivot all of the use of his body that is positive, like petting, hugging, being gentle and feel that positivity like you want it over, like over potty like make it like wow. Like that made me feel really good. And so we’re reprograming the brain to focus more on. Well, my caregiver really likes all this good stuff that I’m doing, and when I’m mad and aggressive, I’m not being pushed away.

 

00;16;27;29 – 00;16;36;22

Dr. Mona

I’m not being like, do. And again, you can do that with the heart that I mentioned. But she’s still around. They’re still around. But you have to protect yourself in this whole situation too.

 

00;16;36;24 – 00;16;53;20

Joia

I am seeing some benefit. I must have heard you reference that earlier in a different podcast. He was at a night. He used to just poke my face while I was getting him dressed. Yeah, poke and poking poke. And I kept reassuring him. And you know, mommy likes kisses. We don’t poke. And now he’ll grab my face gently and just give me kisses while I get him dressed.

 

00;16;53;20 – 00;17;11;28

Joia

So he is learning. Yeah, he’s appropriate ways to interact with mommy. And poking and grabbing is not one of them. So at least at nighttime it seems to have resolved matter. But it’s much better. So yeah, filling the bucket of good stuff is definitely a tactic we’ve taken around here, because it matters with the cats we have in the house and with each other.

 

00;17;11;28 – 00;17;13;24

Joia

And so that is all helping. So that’s a good point.

 

00;17;13;26 – 00;17;30;00

Dr. Mona

There’s so many things in parenting that are patterns across everything that is happening with our child’s behavior. The first one is modeling. Like I’ve spoken about that a lot before and you know that. So that’s why I asked about what you all are doing when he does do this. Like obviously if a parent is hitting back, then I mean, that has to stop, which is not happening here.

 

00;17;30;05 – 00;17;50;14

Dr. Mona

There’s a child will not learn not to hit, their parent is hitting. But in this situation, yeah, the modeling is important. You have to kind of put yourself in the shoes of a two and a half year old who is learning about the world. Everything that’s happening in the world in terms of language, cognitive, like all of that juicy development, their brain is a sponge of everything.

 

00;17;50;16 – 00;18;12;27

Dr. Mona

And so that is overwhelming for the child, right? You think about how you’re learning so much between the ages of two and four, like the amount of neuron synapses happening is astronomical compared to adults, that now you’re having a child who’s being told not to do something when their brain is just over in overdrive, right? And so they also just want to know that they have a safe space with you.

 

00;18;12;27 – 00;18;29;11

Dr. Mona

Right? And that’s why I want us to try to pivot away from the one, two, three and see if that helps your, because I think it will. And I think that other aspect of, oh, man, that physical attention. And I’m speaking personally because Ryan used to be that child who pushed me away in times of tantrums. Right.

 

00;18;29;11 – 00;18;42;04

Dr. Mona

Like we did this from the beginning, like, hey, Ryan, like I would kneel down on the ground and I’m sure you’ve heard this method. I would say, hey, sweetie, I see that you’re having really hard time right now. If you need me, I’m here. If you need a hug, I’m here. Or if you need some space, take some time.

 

00;18;42;06 – 00;18;59;01

Dr. Mona

I would give him that option, right? But I wouldn’t leave the room. I would just be there. And sometimes he would be like, no mommy, no hug, no hug. And I said, okay, I’m here if you need me. And then ten minutes later, after the tantrum still going, I would check in with him again. Like, I’d be like, sweetie, let me know if you need a hug.

 

00;18;59;01 – 00;19;15;04

Dr. Mona

I’m here. I’m not going anywhere. And finally he’d be like, I want the hug. And so now he wants a hug all the time whenever he’s upset. So they could learn it. Some children may not, and that’s their nature, but I don’t want us to say that he will never be that kid, because you already said that you had some moments of that where maybe you can see that.

 

00;19;15;09 – 00;19;34;01

Dr. Mona

And like you said, the filling the cup with the bedtime kisses, right? Like, oh man, their brain wants to be good. They want to do good by us. Meaning they want us to be happy. They’re like puppies, okay? Like, I mean, toddlers in many ways are like puppies. And they don’t want us to be upset. They don’t want us to get mad.

 

00;19;34;04 – 00;19;53;22

Dr. Mona

The difference is that they have human emotions, so they’re going to show their anger and frustration, but they love when we are happy with something that they did. So like you said, the kisses on the face. Oh, that made me feel so good. And change your tone in that very calm and warm like, oh wow, that made me feel so good.

 

00;19;53;22 – 00;20;15;14

Dr. Mona

And they’re going to realize it and be like, wow, this is something that my caregiver really wants me to continue doing. And maybe I’ll continue doing it. Will the anger moments still be there? Absolutely. I’m not saying that that’s going to go away in two days, but you’re going to start to rewire and prune that brain to understand that what we do when we’re upset is maybe we take some moment to breathe, and that’s fine.

 

00;20;15;14 – 00;20;32;14

Dr. Mona

Or maybe we get a hug and that makes us feel better, but we’re not going to throw it, do all that aggressive stuff. And so I think that’s what’s going to really help to. Okay. Yeah. And your question now about when to worry I think that’s also really important. I know that was the focus of the episode, but we had to talk about getting there.

 

00;20;32;17 – 00;20;49;29

Dr. Mona

So I would say that if we’re dealing so he’s two years and eight months, I’m happy to hear the development is going on, milestones and all of that. So here’s a few things. One thing I would say is let’s try the tips that I’m talking about in terms of more connection, especially when upset. Oh, I know that can be really hard.

 

00;20;49;29 – 00;21;12;04

Dr. Mona

But doing that really leaning into the positive reinforcement and the modeling that y’all are doing. And then what I would say is that if you’re doing then for the next few weeks, right, because it takes a few weeks to kind of see changes when we start to implement them consistently. If you’re feeling like has any of his stuff cause true harm, where you have a bruise on your forehead, or you’ve had like a burst vessel in the eye, or anyone has been injured?

 

00;21;12;05 – 00;21;14;27

Dr. Mona

Has it ever been like that or. No.

 

00;21;14;29 – 00;21;16;00

Joia

And nothing severe? No.

 

00;21;16;00 – 00;21;37;22

Dr. Mona

Okay. So the first thing is, if a child is hitting or physically aggressive to the point where it’s causing true injury, which that’s not happening for your son, that was happening. I would say, let’s go get an evaluation with like a child therapist sooner than later. The other thing is about public settings or schools. So I know you said school is also a concern, but that it’s more so with y’all at home, right?

 

00;21;37;24 – 00;21;45;11

Joia

Yeah. And his day care providers just treat it as developmentally appropriate. So that’s been overly concerning. They’re like maybe this is who he is. Yeah.

 

00;21;45;12 – 00;22;12;29

Dr. Mona

So what I would say with that is he’s still two years, eight months. You’re going to work on some of the strategies we’re talking about. And we’re going to see if that helps. Now, if it’s getting to the point where other children are being harmed and you’re also dealing with it at home and you’re like, okay, we’re now dealing with those true injuries, then yes, I would love for you to talk to your pediatrician, to get a child therapist evaluation, to just do a full kind of discussion with y’all about, okay, like what’s happening in the home, what’s happening here, kind of what I’m doing with you, but in a much larger scale.

 

00;22;13;01 – 00;22;34;19

Dr. Mona

And then the other thing I would say is if after three and a half, so two and a half to three and a half is a big time frame, obviously, but we should start to see this aggression improve in the next 4 to 6 months. And even with the tips, you should start to see baby steps. Like I said, in 2 to 3 weeks, if you are feeling like, wow, it’s gotten worse.

 

00;22;34;19 – 00;22;59;22

Dr. Mona

Like I’m really, really trying to implement some calm connection, all of these things, but it’s just snowballed into this awesome thing. Then I would say it’s better always to get the help earlier than later, because what I see often in my office is that a parent has a four year old, okay, a five year old, and they are dealing with what you’re dealing with me here, which at two and a half I’m not super concerned, but it’s not like, okay, don’t do anything right.

 

00;22;59;22 – 00;23;18;10

Dr. Mona

I talk to you for in detail already because sometimes we say to ourselves, okay, but this is developmentally normal. We’re just going to write it out. But there are things that we can do to make sure. Does it last forever? Like, I don’t want him to be A56 year old who is throwing, hitting and kicking because by then there should be more impulse control.

 

00;23;18;10 – 00;23;37;14

Dr. Mona

There should be some more understanding of natural consequences, right by the time the child’s five. So I give three and a half as that, okay. By three and a half if we are still seeing this, I wouldn’t wait till five. I wouldn’t wait till four. I would say it’s still there. I want that extra evaluation and a comment about evaluations.

 

00;23;37;17 – 00;23;51;17

Dr. Mona

It’s always for the best as we know. And I know you know that because you came on to talk to me about this. But for everyone listening, if you’re ever like, I don’t want to see a speech therapist or a behavioral therapist or any of this, I really want to remind you that all this is going to do is benefit the family, right?

 

00;23;51;17 – 00;24;11;13

Dr. Mona

This is going to be something that could potentially help give you skills that you never even heard of, because to kind of go to your point, there is no course influencer for me in the world. There’s nobody that can truly help you unless they’re seeing you face to face with your child, because there’s an art to that, right?

 

00;24;11;13 – 00;24;33;16

Dr. Mona

They see and talk to you. So although I love doing what I’m doing, although I love having you on, although I love, you know, all the information out there, every child is unique and every parent is unique. And then when we put that together, it’s such a nuanced discussion like what we’re talking about. And it’s why I wanted you all to come on the podcast, because this is what is lacking in a lot of the educational content out there, right?

 

00;24;33;16 – 00;24;50;10

Dr. Mona

The situational. But then this happens, like, what about this? And I’m like, you’re right, that’s not in a course or in a discussion, but it is a reality. I mean, I discuss it with families in my office all the time, like, hey, this is a situation that you’re dealing with. So I hope that when to worries can really kind of help you.

 

00;24;50;13 – 00;24;50;23

Joia

Yeah.

 

00;24;50;26 – 00;25;08;16

Dr. Mona

Again, I think we’re in an okay spot now with the understanding that we’re going to work on it. We’re going to really maybe pivot away from the one two threes and really make it more of like, this is a safe space. If you need some time to calm down and let’s say let’s reuse the term calm down because calm down can kind of make it feel also very stigmatizing.

 

00;25;08;16 – 00;25;23;21

Dr. Mona

Like you just need to calm down, right? You can say we’re just going to relax our body a little bit. We’re just going to take a moment to just really reset. Like I rather use the terminology because sometimes, like I said, calm down can feel also very triggering. Like if you’re upset, someone just tells you, calm down, calm down.

 

00;25;23;21 – 00;25;29;19

Dr. Mona

Right. So the wordage, the tone, all of that and I think we’re going to see some changes are I hope so.

 

00;25;29;22 – 00;25;31;13

Joia

Yeah, I hope so too. Yeah.

 

00;25;31;14 – 00;25;35;23

Dr. Mona

Is there any other like take homes or questions related to all this?

 

00;25;35;26 – 00;25;51;02

Joia

I mean, I think the big thing that we can try, I like kind of giving him the reason for the timeout. I mean, he’s a smart kid. So yeah, having him just sit, you know, by himself without mommy or daddy has been aggravating, obviously. So yeah, I like to relax our bodies. Let’s just take a break. Let’s breathe.

 

00;25;51;02 – 00;26;09;16

Joia

Mommy’s going to go over here, you know, offering the hug. I love that, and I love also focusing on the need to de-escalate the situation. Right. Even though I’m calm and I’m trying to be patient, remembering that my focus should be to help de-escalate the situation, I think that shift of frame will help me in addressing what he’s dealing with.

 

00;26;09;16 – 00;26;23;06

Joia

I’m not trying to get the behavior to stop. I’m trying to de-escalate and help him through it. And I think that’s important. So and then we’ll just continue overexaggerating the good stuff and keep celebrating that, because he really does thrive on that kind of craze. We can see that, right?

 

00;26;23;08 – 00;26;42;09

Dr. Mona

It’s a beautiful thing and I know that’s going to change. Like I see it in my own experience, but also just knowing child development and how they’re a little beautiful brains work in that. Yes, he will really thrive on that. And, you know, interestingly about de-escalation, like I used to be a resident assistant at my undergrad. Right. And we actually learned a lot about de-escalation because of, like, college students fighting and did it.

 

00;26;42;23 – 00;27;01;20

Dr. Mona

And yes, a lot of those tips I actually bring into a lot of things that I’m talking about, which is really trying to protect your body. Like I if you follow me on my Instagram, I joke, obviously, that toddlers are kind of like drunk college students and they’re dysregulated. Their emotions are high, they’re toppling all over. Like, it’s almost a humorous way of just kind of reframing, like we talked about.

 

00;27;01;22 – 00;27;16;07

Dr. Mona

But it is like, if I start yelling at one of those college students, like, you need to sit down and did it, and it’s not going to go anywhere, I have to lower my voice. I have to really get very low here. I have to protect my body like I talked about with you and really just say, here’s we’re going to do I give those college students a hug?

 

00;27;16;07 – 00;27;34;29

Dr. Mona

No, that’s a different. But it’s a similar kind of concept of really trying to calm ourselves down and that is an art of this. Like, it’s really hard when your child is running at you and about to hit you for you to stay calm. And it’s something me, my husband talk about a lot because my husband gets very upset.

 

00;27;34;29 – 00;27;56;10

Dr. Mona

Like he will start yelling at him back. I understand where it’s coming from. My husband’s not a yeller as it is, but I know it’s very hard for you. I’m not saying that it’s easy watching your child run to you, but the more you get agitated in like a body language situation where you’re like, stop. Like, I know we have to protect ourselves, but you can protect yourself, but also say, mommy’s just going to put her hands over her head.

 

00;27;56;12 – 00;28;12;10

Dr. Mona

I won’t let you hit me. I see that you’re upset. We need to take a moment. Right. It’s different than okay. Oh my gosh. Like, get away. You know, like, stop hitting me. And that is a small little way that I think is going to change. But like I said, I’m just so grateful that we could have this nuanced discussion about all of the stuff that I don’t think is often talked about.

 

00;28;12;17 – 00;28;17;26

Joia

Yeah, no, thank you very much. I appreciate the wisdom.

 

00;28;17;29 – 00;28;37;14

Dr. Mona

I love when I get to chat with you all from the pizza talk to our community. So as a reminder, if you want to join me to talk with me about a certain concern that you have with your child, mom, life, parenting, life, whatever it is, make sure you join our newsletter or email list. And that is where we send out the form to invite people to come on the show.

 

00;28;37;17 – 00;28;56;08

Dr. Mona

I want to wrap up this episode with Joy, with some reminders on the big principles here that we talked about. Number one is modeling the behavior you want when it comes to aggression. We talked about how that is not something that they do. They obviously do not hit their child, which is something very important to me. But modeling also means how are we approaching times of dysregulation?

 

00;28;56;08 – 00;29;19;26

Dr. Mona

How are we approaching those moments of very big feelings. And it can be really hard. Like I said, when your child is coming at you and about to hit you to model calm, but that is kind of when they need it the most. So I want you to really start to channel that, listen to a lot of my episodes on this show so that you can learn how to reset your mind, really get to that phase of, I’m going to be the escalator of the situation.

 

00;29;19;27 – 00;29;34;00

Dr. Mona

I’m not going to add tension. I’m not going to add fear, I’m not going to add threats to the situation, and I’m going to be the calm leader of my home. The second thing is, I want you to remember to always highlight the right children. Spend so much time hearing, don’t do this, don’t do this, don’t do this.

 

00;29;34;00 – 00;29;49;07

Dr. Mona

But we want to really highlight what they’re doing, how great they are doing, the little things that they do. Like I said, bringing your plate to the sink or when they give you a hug and it makes you feel good. We want to build those neurons, build those neurons so that they feel better about themselves. And lastly, don’t forget to connect.

 

00;29;49;09 – 00;30;03;19

Dr. Mona

You got to connect with them. You got to really show them that you love them. Even during times of dysregulation and anger and aggression, you always have to set your physical boundaries of you’re not able to throw all of those things, but it’s also really important to remind them that you still love them, that you’re there for them.

 

00;30;03;19 – 00;30;24;04

Dr. Mona

You’re not going anywhere, that even during their moments of vulnerability, that you are with them as a team. I hope you love this episode. I love this conversation. It was such a great way to talk about the nuance of parenting. And like I said, if you want to join us on the podcast, make sure you join the newsletter so that you can get the form to come on.

 

00;30;24;04 – 00;30;27;01

Dr. Mona

And I cannot wait to talk to another parent next time.