Mirror neurons are one of the keys to child development. Our babies and kids are watching and observing us and how we interact with them, others, and ourselves. On this episode, I welcome Chris Lake, a young childhood development expert and educator, and founder of Behavior Booster, to discuss:

 

• The science behind mirror neurons
• How we as parents can use mirror neurons to our benefit in child development and parenting
• Why modeling for our kids is so important

 

Connect with Chris on Instagram @behaviorbooster.

 

We love the sponsors that make this show possible! You can always find all the special deals and codes for all our current sponsors on the PedsDocTalk Podcast Sponsors page of the website.

00;00;01;03 – 00;00;17;18
Chris Lake
The more they witness someone do something, the more the brain lit up, especially if the thing someone was doing was familiar to them. So like if a piano player witnesses another piano player play more of the brain lights up than someone who does not play the piano. At the same time, someone who doesn’t know how to play the piano.

00;00;17;21 – 00;00;34;27
Chris Lake
The part of the brain that’s dictating the fingers moving is still lighting up, watching someone play the piano. The same thing is true for sports. If you played a sport as a kid and you watch someone play sports on TV, parts of your brain that are dictated by your legs, knees, arms, hips moving are lighting up despite the fact you’re sitting down.

00;00;35;00 – 00;00;47;03
Chris Lake
And it creates this understanding that we are learning from observation, in a way that we’re almost perfect coding and remapping how our body is supposed to function in order to make things happen.

00;00;47;06 – 00;01;08;10
Dr. Mona
Welcome back to the PedsDocTalk podcast. It continues to grow because of you and your reviews. A podcast where I get to welcome the most amazing guests to chat about all things parenting, child health development, and parental mental health. And today’s guest is a repeat guest who I had to have back on the show because our last episode was so amazing and I got such amazing feedback.

00;01;08;15 – 00;01;34;27
Dr. Mona
It is Chris Lake. He is a young childhood development expert and educator, founder of Behavior Booster, which helps parents navigate challenging behaviors and build on desired behaviors. And we are talking about mirror neurons today. Why they’re important in child development. Before you forget, make sure you listen to our other episode, which was Tips to De-escalating a tantrum where you can learn about the lake method of de-escalating tantrums, which was awesome.

00;01;35;03 – 00;01;39;20
Dr. Mona
But today we are welcoming back Chris. Thank you so much for joining me again on the show.

00;01;39;22 – 00;01;42;09
Chris Lake
Great to be here, doctor. Mona, always a pleasure.

00;01;42;11 – 00;01;53;17
Dr. Mona
Always a pleasure. That last conversation we had was so good. I love chatting with you about all things parenting and tell everyone who did not listen to that last episode. Just briefly add more about yourself and what you do.

00;01;53;19 – 00;02;10;11
Chris Lake
Certainly. So I am a special educator and child advocate that’s worked with Joe in autism for the last 17 years. And my goal is to help make charging behavior more navigable and help boost children’s ability to reach their milestones through consulting, through workshops, through my book, etc..

00;02;10;14 – 00;02;33;05
Dr. Mona
Awesome. And like I said already the other episode that we recorded, you must listen to that one. Once you finish listening to this one, because we chat so much about just child development and that one as well. And we’ll talk about that in this conversation, which is about mirror neurons, why they’re important in child development. So tell us, what are mirror neurons, why you think they’re the the gateway of parenting and breakthroughs.

00;02;33;07 – 00;02;51;04
Chris Lake
So it’s incredibly interesting. In my line of work, we have to do a lot of imitation to get children with autism toddlers to actually learn different skills. And it turns out humans are very social creatures. And we do an incredible amount of observational learning, which is why almost virtually any job anyone’s had, they had to do a follow up.

00;02;51;04 – 00;03;11;27
Chris Lake
They had to observe someone first and see, oh, that’s how I do this. That’s how I do this. That’s how I do this. So to backtrack, in 1992, there was a research team led by Doctor Pellegrino, and they were trying to see the relationship between hand mouth activity in the brains of macaque monkeys and using very thin electrode needles and put them into their brains and study their, premotor cortex.

00;03;12;04 – 00;03;34;12
Chris Lake
And it studied every time it fired when it reached for a nut native reach for not eating. And then one day, one of the grad students walked into the room and had lunch, and they were eating nuts of their own. The Mack monkey that they were studying was just watching this grad student, and when it simply watched the grad student eat a peanut, the same exact part of his brain lit up as if the monkey itself had reached and eaten the nut.

00;03;34;12 – 00;03;54;16
Chris Lake
And they said, wait a second, what just happened? Why did his brain light up like that? He’s not moving. He’s just watching someone do something that makes no sense. So first he thought the machine was off. I thought he thought the tech was broken. And after that, after they went through that, there was no. It turns out that the same part of our brains fire, whether we’re doing something or we witnessed someone doing something.

00;03;54;18 – 00;04;12;20
Chris Lake
And that made people start doing a whole rabbit hole of research and using electroencephalography to study the premotor and motor regions of the frontal cortex, as well as the parietal lobes where they started sliding up. What’s happening? Okay, so the mirror neurons aren’t like specialized cells. It’s just how the cells fire in certain areas of the brain.

00;04;12;26 – 00;04;32;01
Chris Lake
And the particular areas of brain that light up are the ones that control movement as well as touch, spatial navigation, language processing, interpreting sounds, using language, and also in some cases, object recognition. And they found that the more they witnessed someone do something, the more the brain lit up, especially if the thing someone was doing was familiar to them.

00;04;32;01 – 00;04;48;20
Chris Lake
So like if a piano player witnesses another piano player play more of the brain lights up than someone who does not play the piano. At the same time, someone who doesn’t know how to play the piano. The part of the brain that’s dictating the fingers moving is still lighting up, watching someone play the piano. The same thing is true for sports.

00;04;48;20 – 00;05;11;11
Chris Lake
If you played a sport as a kid and you watch someone play sports on TV, parts of your brain that are dictated by your legs, knees, arms, hips moving are lighting up despite the fact you’re sitting down. And it creates this understanding that we are learning from observation. In a way that we’re almost pre coding and pre mapping how our body is supposed to function in order to make things happen.

00;05;11;13 – 00;05;29;21
Chris Lake
There was a 2009 study done where they had people watch a dance video being modeled versus giving them symbolic instructions on how to do the dance, and they found that parts of their brain that really lit up the superior temporal cortex, really lit up when they watched a human dance. And then when they had them actually try to do the dance afterwards.

00;05;29;21 – 00;05;51;27
Chris Lake
Everyone who saw a human did it did much better versus getting simple instructions. And we had in 2010, UCLA professor Jack Boney, he had a hypothesis that there’s going to be a connection between the emotional system as well as the motor system. So now he want to play with this in the limbic system. And when he does this, he put them in fMRI with goggles on to see pictures of people at different emotional expressions.

00;05;52;00 – 00;06;08;08
Chris Lake
And he had the, he had the participant basically first match the expression on the face of each emotion. So the person smiling, the smile, they’re grimacing, the grimacing. And he studied what parts of the brain light up when they make these expressions in their face. And then he said, okay, now look at these expressions again. But keep still.

00;06;08;09 – 00;06;33;21
Chris Lake
Don’t do not move. Same exact parts of the brain still lit up. And this this creates part of a hypothesis. Hypothesis? Because it is all correlational, that this is where empathy comes from. When witnessing people have certain emotions. We are we are experiencing those emotions, which is part of why when we watch a movie, we can cry as part of, you know, if it’s sad enough or joyful enough or, or if it’s Pixar or anything.

00;06;33;24 – 00;06;35;08
Chris Lake

00;06;35;11 – 00;06;37;00
Dr. Mona
So yeah, they’re good.

00;06;37;06 – 00;06;39;05
Chris Lake
Yeah, they’re they’re so good. I don’t know why.

00;06;39;05 – 00;06;52;11
Dr. Mona
They’re so good. Yeah. I am a water we’re kind of gal. But those movies, man, I’m like a he like I’m, ugly crying if you will, all the time. Which is like my mirror. My mirror neurons are being triggered very significantly, for sure.

00;06;52;13 – 00;07;17;19
Chris Lake
Yeah. So. But, we are we are constantly learning from each other. We are constantly also experiencing what other people see around us or experiencing, and this is for me as a, as a special educator, makes me consider how we interact with our children as parents, how we interact with children’s providers, because it’s that monkey see, monkey do tality if your child sees you cooking in the kitchen, they might and you had they have a kitchen that they’re going to imitate stirring in a bowl, they’re going to imitate washing dishes.

00;07;17;19 – 00;07;35;27
Chris Lake
They’re going to imitate certain things without you instructing them on how to do it. You don’t teach your kid how to play house. A kid just sees mom and dad housing and decides, today I’m going to imitate mom and Dad. If they see Mom and dad use tools, they’re going to imitate using tools. If they see their siblings kicking a ball or playing in some sort of way, they imitate it.

00;07;35;27 – 00;07;57;29
Chris Lake
They don’t need to walk through it specifically. Now this is where I’m going to lose some of your audience. Maybe, the issue is when a child is given a bit more screen time to observe human behavior or behavior than human time, right now, do the mirror neurons still fire? If you are watching a human do something on a screen?

00;07;58;02 – 00;08;20;17
Chris Lake
Yes they do. However, the fire about half as much. Okay, yeah, that means the brain is getting half as much access to information. Half as much, opportunity to consider how do I map my body? As I said, parts of the brain that try to lobes temporal lobes. These are language processing areas. And a lot of how kids learn how to talk is through something called mouth gazing.

00;08;20;20 – 00;08;41;05
Chris Lake
When they transition from purely babbling to trying new sounds, babbling. And you hear it when you have a, you know, an infant toddler transition, like, wait a second, that’s a new sound. What’s going oh, that’s new sound to they’re experimenting with sounds, but moreover, because they’re watching you talk, the more you talk to your child, the more you put your kid on your knees, your lap and just talk about anything.

00;08;41;05 – 00;08;49;18
Chris Lake
It doesn’t matter. Talk about your day. Talk about washing their hair. Talk about a book. You read. Talk about celebrity drama. It really doesn’t. It doesn’t matter.

00;08;49;20 – 00;08;50;12
Dr. Mona
It doesn’t.

00;08;50;14 – 00;09;08;22
Chris Lake
Doesn’t matter. Whatever you talk about, they’re getting information about how your jaw, how your lips, how your tongue, how your teeth, how your uvula in the back of your throat, how your neck, everything, how they all are doing something. And speech is so incredibly complex that we take it for granted because we do it everyday, all day long.

00;09;08;25 – 00;09;27;08
Chris Lake
But there’s only 12 cranial neurons that go from cranial nerves, excuse me, that go from our brain all the way down to the rest of our body that dictate what we’re doing. And fully half of those are necessary for speech. Right. So including the diaphragm, including the larynx, parts of your body that you’re not even seeing, the kid has to figure out how do I breath control, breathe.

00;09;27;08 – 00;09;45;28
Chris Lake
How do I make a fricative sound. How do I okay, this bar has to vibrate. I don’t know how to do that. So when they mouth gaze, they’re getting that information of how the mouth moves and it’s going to light up those mirror neurons. This is not very present in screens we don’t typically see into the mouths of actors and actresses.

00;09;46;01 – 00;10;05;14
Chris Lake
We can see their teeth. We don’t see their top right. We’re not looking into the mouth. It’s usually pretty decent, with the exception of, say, I have to give this person of roses, Miss Rachel. She is fantastic at actually bringing a screen right up to her face when she wants to share sounds. And that’s that’s like a speech therapist technique that I wasn’t there.

00;10;05;14 – 00;10;08;15
Chris Lake
So I was like, wow, you are such quality program.

00;10;08;15 – 00;10;12;06
Dr. Mona
And so yeah, yeah, she’s great. I do like her too.

00;10;12;14 – 00;10;28;03
Chris Lake
Oh man. Such quality. But that makes a huge difference. And you know, as someone who’s working with kids who are going from nonverbal to verbal whenever I start seeing kid mouth is in my head, I’m like, oh, you’ve crossed over. You start in tangent to that. Cool. It’ll just be a few weeks or days that you might start making new sounds.

00;10;28;03 – 00;10;45;17
Chris Lake
And once, once that chain reaction happens, speech will progress. But they have done studies. It was a speech in Japan, where they took 84,000 toddlers, who watched 3.5 hours of TV or more and or 3.5 hours of screen time or more, and they found there was a speech delay, and people get upset when they hear that.

00;10;45;17 – 00;11;04;07
Chris Lake
But, as we talked about in the last episode, you know, what’s the proof? There’s proof that if a child has too much screen time, they’re not going to be on the same path, typically towards speech and communication. Are there exceptions? Of course there are exceptions, exceptions to everything, but they are not getting access to the information as if instead of three hours they had two hours.

00;11;04;08 – 00;11;21;02
Chris Lake
An hour and a half was spent. You just talking to them or even a half an hour. It’s don’t you just talking with them. So it’s imperative for parents to take the opportunity to, to utilize this knowledge about mirror neurons and say, okay, how much stuff can I demonstrate for my kid so that they can start to try to do new things?

00;11;21;04 – 00;11;37;22
Chris Lake
My wife had a wild idea when our newborn was not even crawling yet. Right? This is this is tummy time period. And she said, well, maybe how is she supposed to crawl? Right? She asked me the question, why is it we expect kids just will know how to crawl, how she’s supposed to crawl? She’s never seen anyone ever.

00;11;37;22 – 00;11;39;02
Dr. Mona
Yeah, absolutely.

00;11;39;04 – 00;11;56;15
Chris Lake
And I thought I said, you know, that’s a really good question. And especially because my child is a pandemic baby. So we’re around. No other children or the people. When my kid was four months old, three months old. And so we we took an afternoon to take turns crawling so my baby could see us actually crawling on the floor.

00;11;56;15 – 00;12;16;27
Chris Lake
And the next day she started crawling. I mean, yeah, there’s something to demonstration. And allowing a child to have observation to learn. And, you know, observation and attendance are the foundations of learning. And trial and compliance are next. So parents take advantage, demonstrate everything and anything you can give your child access to seeing you do limit screen time.

00;12;16;27 – 00;12;38;25
Chris Lake
I’m not saying no screen time. You know, you don’t have to be that wild. But you know, the more you are engaging with your kid, the greater the advantages your kid has to learn to try and to get feedback. And just to give another example, if a child is watching on their iPad, kids play at a gym or play at a jungle gym, for example, in the park, and they’re sitting on a couch and they’re watching kissing.

00;12;38;25 – 00;13;02;12
Chris Lake
And a jungle gym will then mirror neurons fire. We’ve already established, yes, they will see kids on the monkey bars, or see kids go down a slide and parts of the by the arms or legs. Parts of the device internally will light up in their brain. However, that’s where it starts and stops. Comparatively, when you take a child to the park and they see the very same activities, that part of the brain is lighting up stronger, okay, for one.

00;13;02;12 – 00;13;20;01
Chris Lake
But then the immediate access to try and as a result, they’re going to learn what works and what doesn’t. Their proprioceptive system is going to be more lit up. Their knowledge of how this works by that trial, by our playing will be lit up and they’re going to learn faster. So, you know, the human human experience cannot be stressed enough.

00;13;20;01 – 00;13;32;20
Chris Lake
Take advantage. Bring your kids out, plan playdates. You know, get them just in analog environments as much as possible because they will learn from that more efficiently, more efficiently than pure screen time.

00;13;32;23 – 00;13;56;15
Dr. Mona
Now let’s take a break to hear from our sponsors. Yeah, and I love that you mentioned that you know about the screen time and that yes, I think screen time is a tool. But we have to prioritize other developmental activities face to face contact with the caregiver. And I love that you’re also pandemic parent because, you know, sometimes parents can feel like, you know, that their children in the pandemic didn’t have their that exposure to others modeling.

00;13;56;15 – 00;14;12;03
Dr. Mona
But remember, as a parent, you did it perfectly. You guys took an afternoon to bottle crawling. So don’t you know, if you’re listening to this, you’re like, oh, but you know, in the pandemic I didn’t get to do that. This don’t worry about it. It’s it’s you as a parent are modeling and they’re looking at their primary caregiver.

00;14;12;05 – 00;14;29;15
Dr. Mona
You know, you talked about like modeling so early I agree I think modeling is one of the biggest things because of the mirror neuron concept. And I still remember when my son was an infant and I’d be talking to him very exaggerated movements. And yes, that and the way he would tilt his head like almost like almost like a puppy, right?

00;14;29;15 – 00;14;45;09
Dr. Mona
Yes. You’re talking. Yes. I think you know that. They’re absorbing it. So you tilt the head and you’re talking and it’s like, almost like, Oh, and then his eyes, his eyebrows would furrow. You can see it, especially the infancy period that even though they’re not talking back to you, like, hey, mom, I agree with what you’re saying, right?

00;14;45;10 – 00;15;03;20
Dr. Mona
Oh, those pre-verbal communication skills are building and it’s a beautiful thing. And I love all the things that you mentioned about mirror neurons and understanding that. And so you already briefly alluded to this, but how can a parent use mirror neurons to their benefit in parenting and child development? You know, but is there anything else that you want to add about that?

00;15;03;21 – 00;15;23;10
Chris Lake
Yes. Play skills in particular. Now play plays. Our kids learn and they do a lot of trial by error. They’re also going to build manual dexterity skills, which is very important because so much of what we actually do in our day to day life is hand based. So yeah, one thing that I’ve witnessed parents do, and I’ve heard parents come to me over the years is they’ll say, I got my kid this toy and they want nothing to do with it.

00;15;23;13 – 00;15;40;03
Chris Lake
And, you know, I ask, well, did you show him how to use it? And they look dumbfounded. So if you buy a child a toy, if it’s the first time getting a puzzle, if it’s the first time getting a kitchenette, if it’s the first time seeing crayons, whatever it may be, it’s beneficial to demonstrate how to use this.

00;15;40;03 – 00;16;10;17
Chris Lake
Oh, this is how I play with this and aim to play with there for like a minute or two as opposed to like four seconds. Pretend to get into it, make it look like you’re having fun and that’s going to make them more enticed to try it as well. So the more you demonstrate, the more they’re going to have that information, access to that map, that neural map of what parts of my body is, how my fingers can rotate, how my wrist needs to move to put that puzzle piece, and whatever it may be that will give them that access to successfully trying and engaging in these tools.

00;16;10;17 – 00;16;30;06
Chris Lake
And the more they successfully try and engage in these tools, you’re building kids confidence. Anthony Robbins says happiness is progress, and I agree with that. I also say that it’s in part mastery the more you give a kid opportunities to establish. I mastered that shapes or have mastered that puzzle. I mastered that they’re going to have that confidence to try new things and feel confident and comfortable trying new things.

00;16;30;13 – 00;16;47;17
Chris Lake
And that’s going to open a lot more doorways. And it’s just that, nah, I’m good. Just give me the iPad. I’m great. I don’t I don’t want to do that. I’m fine with that. So demonstrate how to play. Demonstrate how to share, you know, with your partner or with your adult support network, you know, if you want your kid sharing, but they’re not seeing you share.

00;16;47;19 – 00;17;04;18
Chris Lake
They are missing a certain map. So sometimes you got to ham it up, like you say, when you exaggerated speech and said, hi, sweetheart. How I you know what I mean? It feels silly. It feels a little ridiculous. And I tell parents, you don’t have to do it forever, but it is helpful and, you know, get like you have to do it.

00;17;04;20 – 00;17;06;05
Chris Lake
But there are benefits to doing.

00;17;06;05 – 00;17;07;12
Dr. Mona
Yes, there are.

00;17;07;15 – 00;17;24;10
Chris Lake
Benefits of doing it. So that that would be the big takeaway, you know, show them how pretend play with your partner or play with whatever adult support network you have, or play with the older siblings, whether you’re playing nurse or you’re playing dress up or you’re playing, you know, whatever game you want to play with your kids demonstrate.

00;17;24;10 – 00;17;38;04
Chris Lake
And that’s going to help them have access and get it a little better as opposed to that. Here you go. Figure it out. You do it now. You feel like you give them a chance to have that mentorship. As often as possible. You are the first mentor. You are the first teacher.

00;17;38;06 – 00;17;55;02
Dr. Mona
Yeah. And so much of this can be built in, in infancy, and it’s not something that’s difficult. I think sometimes when we look at play and look at, oh, but I got a model like like you said, you’re like you said earlier, talking about your day, talking about your favorite sports team. We’re talking about something we don’t have to make it so.

00;17;55;07 – 00;18;22;15
Dr. Mona
Oh, well, I have to have this exaggerated conversation about baby directed activities. No. Like, maybe their world is your world. Like they’re learning what you say. Like I always say, like from a young age. Like, even when it’s hard to do this because I have had so many conversations with parents like they don’t understand. Like I get that they may not understand as a two month old or four month old, but you’re basing the foundation and you’re laying the foundation of, I’m going to start modeling because I know that this is really great for me.

00;18;22;15 – 00;18;40;15
Dr. Mona
Like even from when he was an infant, I would talk to him like I would narrate, oh, mom is going to pour your bottle, right? He’s going to do this, and I’m going to get this together in here. And yes, I am a very parentis, speaker, in terms of that exaggerated, high singsong voice. And there is research behind it, but it doesn’t have to be difficult.

00;18;40;15 – 00;18;54;29
Dr. Mona
And I think sometimes parents overcomplicate so much of child development because they feel like, oh, like, I can’t do this and I have to read this book and, it has to be this elaborate thing. And yes, books are great, but talking to them is also really important. And connecting with them, you know?

00;18;55;05 – 00;19;13;12
Chris Lake
Right. It doesn’t have to be perfect. It doesn’t have to be lesson. You know, singing is also a great because that’s also exaggerated. Speech is slowly enunciating or slowly making the sounds and shapes for each, phoneme, so to speak. But you don’t have to sing old MacDonald if you don’t like it. You can sing your song. But if you want to sing the Beatles sing the Beatles.

00;19;13;12 – 00;19;30;09
Chris Lake
If you want to sing and stuff, you know what I mean? Because they’re still getting information, is still witnessing your mouth do things, and now they have access to realize, oh, mouths can do that too. I want to try that. And that’s just going to lead them along a bit further. So, you know, be authentic in how you raise your kid, obviously.

00;19;30;11 – 00;19;38;16
Chris Lake
And experiment with, you know, also try new things, meet in the middle, but demonstrate, demonstrate, demonstrate, you know, lay the pathway as much as you can.

00;19;38;18 – 00;19;54;12
Dr. Mona
Love it. Oh, Chris, this was such a great conversation. And I love talking child development. And I love talking child development with you because I love the way you bring out recent studies, but also just applying that to parenting in general, your own experiences with the patients and clients that you see. What would be your final message?

00;19;54;12 – 00;20;02;17
Dr. Mona
You’ve had so many great pearls, not only in this conversation, but our other episode as well, about the escalating tantrums. But final message for everyone listening today.

00;20;02;20 – 00;20;18;22
Chris Lake
I’m going to say do the work. You know, usually with the key is kindness. And I still always want to leave with that, but also do the work. It doesn’t need to be all day, every day, but you know, if you have half an hour every Saturday that you can really set aside to intentionally seed your child with, demonstrations, start there.

00;20;18;27 – 00;20;35;01
Chris Lake
Obviously more is better, but make a plan. Make a goal. Talk to your partner or your adult. Support whoever they may be, your commiserating people, whoever’s in your group chat, you need to talk to you and say, hey, what’s a good way for me to increase this skill? What’s a good way for me to demonstrate this? Be creative.

00;20;35;03 – 00;20;44;21
Chris Lake
Be creative, be playful, be silly and enjoy it. Enjoy the process because it moves pretty fast and you can’t really go back in time once it’s gone.

00;20;44;24 – 00;20;53;10
Dr. Mona
Yes, I love those are wonderful final messages. Where can everyone find you to stay connected, to get more of your resources and all of your amazing education?

00;20;53;13 – 00;21;15;05
Chris Lake
Absolutely. So you can find me at Behavior booster.com, as well as 101 Behavior hacks.com on IG. You can find me at Chris Lake or at Behavior Booster. On my site you’ll find my book Help Your Talent Meet Their Milestones 101 Behavior Hacks, as well as my E course that helps give parents some guidance towards navigating behaviors positive and negative, and otherwise.

00;21;15;05 – 00;21;24;28
Chris Lake
You can find me on LinkedIn, Chris Lake NYC. Reach out any of the ways that I just told you. If you have questions, you know I’d love to help out in any way that will make your life as a parent a little bit easier.

00;21;25;00 – 00;21;43;14
Dr. Mona
Oh, I love this and I love having you on the show. You’re a pleasure to talk to, and also for you to have this platform to share this education. And this guidance is so important to me because what you’re teaching the world is so valuable. So again, thank you so much, Chris, for all that you do in the parenting space, but also for joining me today.

00;21;43;16 – 00;21;46;12
Chris Lake
Thank you. Thank you back, Mona. Always a pleasure. And for always.

00;21;46;16 – 00;22;05;03
Dr. Mona
Yeah. And for everyone listening. I hope you love this conversation because I sure did. And I love having Chris on the show. Make sure you leave a review and rating and call out the episode. Say I love the episode with Chris. Like it was so awesome. This makes us learn what you guys like to hear on the show, and I’d be surprised if you don’t want to hear more of Chris on my channel.

00;22;05;05 – 00;22;11;18
Dr. Mona
So, so thank you. Thanks for the review and reading, and I cannot wait to talk to another guest next week.

00;22;11;19 – 00;22;27;10
Dr. Mona
Thank you for tuning in for this week’s episode. As always, please leave a review or share this episode with a friend. Share it on your social media. Make sure to follow me at PedsDocTalk on Instagram and subscribe to my YouTube channel, PedsDocTalk TV. We’ll talk to you soon.